19861102 Śrīmad Bhāgavatam 4.22.36

The following is a lecture given by His Holiness Jayapatākā Swami on November 2^nd 1986 in New Panihati Dham in Atlanta, Georgia. The class begins with a reading from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, 4^th Canto Chapter 22 verse 36.

Translation: We accept as blessings different states of higher life, distinguishing them from lower states of life, but we should know that such distinctions exist only in relation to the interchange of the modes of material nature. Actually these states of life have no permanent existence, for all of them will be destroyed by the supreme controller.

Purport: In our material existence we accept a higher form of life as a blessing and a lower form as a curse. This distinction of “higher” and “lower” only exists as long as the different material qualities (guṇas) interact. In other words, by our good activities we are elevated to the higher planetary systems or to a higher standard of life (good education, beautiful body, etc.). These are the results of pious activities. Similarly, by impious activities we remain illiterate, get ugly bodies, a poor standard of living, etc. But all these different states of life are under the laws of material nature through the interaction of the qualities of goodness, passion and ignorance. However, all these qualities will cease to act at the time of the dissolution of the entire cosmic manifestation. The Lord therefore says in Bhagavad-gītā (8.16): 

ābrahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ
punar āvartino ’rjuna
mām upetya tu kaunteya
punar janma na vidyate

Even though we elevate ourselves to the highest planetary system by the scientific advancement of knowledge or by the religious principles of life — great sacrifices and fruitive activities — at the time of dissolution these higher planetary systems and life on them will be destroyed. In this verse the words īśa-vidhvaṁsitāśiṣām indicate that all such blessings will be destroyed by the supreme controller. We will not be protected. Our bodies, either in this planet or in another planet, will be destroyed, and again we will have to remain for millions of years in an unconscious state within the body of Mahā-Viṣṇu. And again, when the creation is manifested, we have to take birth in different species of life and begin our activities. Therefore, we should not be satisfied simply by a promotion to the higher planetary systems. We should try to get out of the material cosmic manifestation, go to the spiritual world and take shelter of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That is our highest achievement. We should not be attracted by anything material, higher or lower, but should consider them all on the same level. Our real engagement should be in inquiring about the real purpose of life and rendering devotional service to the Lord. Thus we will be eternally blessed in our spiritual activities, full of knowledge and bliss.

Jai Śrī Nitāi-Gaura Ki! Jai! Rādhā Madana Mohan Ki! Jai! Jagannātha Baladeva Subhadrā Ki! Jai!

People work very hard to get a higher standard of living especially here in the America always find a…sometimes people husband wife both holding jobs, working double time and the normal purpose for that is they’re always trying to get a higher standard of living, this is the nature of the material world, we consider that more comfortable living,  this is the perfection of life – it’s the highest goal of course even when people get it relatively higher standard of living, good education, good body, good looks, nice facilities still that doesn’t completely satisfy all their aspirations, sometimes they might give to the charity considering the welfare of those who are less fortunate or considering may be that will protect them in the future from losing their good fortune but actually the Bhāgavatam being the text on pure spiritual knowledge is enthusing us that we should not simply become infatuated with higher standards of material life because the entire material creation in any case even if we achieve the highest planet of the material world or the highest standards of the material life, eventually the entire material world is going to in any case would wound up and any living entities who have not developed their dormant God consciousness they again have to also being destroyed the material situation and they take shelter of the body of Mahā-Viṣṇu for some period of time, millions of millions of years in an unconscious state, so that actually where there, of course you don’t have to wait that long. Right now, in this material world, at this planet people will die a lot sooner than the wind up of the material world and whether one is president of the United States or whether one's a richest man, these things are not permanent nor able to protect us from the ultimate miseries of material life. Of course, it’s interesting to note that even the economic situation is at such that even some multi billionaires can lose their fortune in a matter of months at the present time, there’s this one big family in Texas had 8 billion dollars and just due to change in the investment climate or whatever, a certain of their holdings, they lost practically all of their wealth and now they’re in debt from 8 billion to in debt. So, the material world is a very flickering place, this was explained by Govinda Dāsa.

Jīvana ṭalamala kamala dala-jala that the material world, the life in this material world is something as steady as a drop of water on a lotus leaf. Lotus leaf’s float on top of the water and their very lubricated, they have some type of “water proofing on them provided by the nature so a drop of water beads up when on top of a lotus leaf but because the lotus leaf is floating in the water which is constantly moving, a little drop of water is just skimmering here and there, it's never steady, so if you try to balance it on such a moving surface, it’s very difficult but Govinda Dāsa say well your material life is like that steady, everything might be well figured out but then the very nature of the material world is that it's always fluctuating and  moving.

Kṛṣṇa explained it in two words duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam a place of suffering in a temporary world, so whatever we do for happiness it eventually brings with it anxiety and suffering but one can say well by having a very good material higher situation there’s less suffering and there’s more happiness, there’s more comfort so therefore this is a blessing but here Pṛthu Mahārāja and the four Kumaras are discussing this topic for the welfare of the human race, the welfare of the world. And this is what their conclusion is someone should engage rather in devotional service that they should try to become Kṛṣṇa conscious through bhakti-yoga, not be overly attached to their material success, that one may have because that success if you have that type of situation, then better to use it for Kṛṣṇa because it’s not dependable whether end of this life or this material world, somehow you are not going to able to keep whatever material success you have so whatever situation, you have a situation which enables you to perform devotional service then immediately take advantage of it, because that is what’s going to remain with you, that’s your permanent asset, that is actually the highest perfection of life. So, I’ll continue with the purport.

Regulated human civilization promotes dharma, artha, kāma and mokṣa. In human society there must be religion. Without religion, human society is only animal society. Economic development and sense gratification must be based on[upon] religious principles. When religion, economic development and sense gratification are adjusted, liberation from this material birth, death, old age and disease is assured. In the present Age of Kali, however, there is no question of religion and liberation. People have taken interest only in economic development and sense gratification. Therefore,

Śrīla Prabhupāda continues:-

Despite sufficient economic development all over the world, dealings in human society have become almost animalistic. When everything becomes grossly animalistic, dissolution takes place. This dissolution is to be accepted as īśa-vidhvaṁsitāśiṣām: the Lord’s so-called blessings of economic development and sense gratification will be conclusively dissolved by destruction. At the end of this Kali-yuga, the Lord will appear as the incarnation of Kalki, and His only business will be to kill all human beings on the surface of the globe. After that killing, another golden age will begin. We should therefore know that our material activities are just like childish play. Children may play on the beach, and the father will sit and watch this childish play — the construction of buildings with sand, the construction of walls and so many things — but finally the father will ask the children to come home. Then everything is destroyed. Persons who are too much addicted to the childish activities of economic development and sense gratification are sometimes especially favoured by the Lord when He destroys their construction of these things.

It is said by the Lord: yasyāham anugṛhṇāmi hariṣye tad-dhanaṁ śanaiḥ. The Lord told Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja that His special favor is shown to His devotee when He takes away all the devotee’s material opulences. Generally, therefore, it is experienced that Vaiṣṇavas are not very opulent in the material sense. When a Vaiṣṇava, pure devotee, tries to be materially opulent and at the same time desires to serve the Supreme Lord, his devotional service is checked. The Lord, in order to show him a special favor, destroys his so-called economic development and material opulences. Thus the devotee, being frustrated in his repeated attempts at economic development, ultimately takes solid shelter under the lotus feet of the Lord. This kind of action may also be accepted as īśa-vidhvaṁsitāśiṣām, whereby the Lord destroys one’s material opulence but enriches one in spiritual understanding. In the course of our preaching work, we sometimes see that materialistic persons come to us and offer their obeisances to take blessings, which means they want more and more material opulences. If such material opulences are checked, such persons are no longer interested in offering obeisances to the devotees. Such materialistic persons are always concerned about their economic development. They offer obeisances to saintly persons or the Supreme Lord and give something in charity for preaching work with a view that they will be rewarded with further economic development.

However, when one is sincere in his devotional service, the Lord obliges the devotee to give up his material development and completely surrender unto Him. Because the Lord does not give blessings of material opulence to His devotee, people are afraid of worshiping Lord Viṣṇu because they see that the Vaiṣṇavas, who are worshipers of Lord Viṣṇu, are poor in superficial material opulences. Such materialistic persons, however, get immense opportunity for economic development by worshiping Lord Śiva, for Lord Śiva is the husband of the Goddess Durgā, the proprietor of this universe. By the grace of Lord Śiva, a devotee gets the opportunity to be blessed by the Goddess Durgā. Rāvaṇa, for example, was a great worshiper and devotee of Lord Śiva, and in return he got all the blessings of Goddess Durgā, so much so that his whole kingdom was constructed of golden buildings. In Brazil, in this present age, huge quantities of gold have been found, and from historical references in the Purāṇas, we can guess safely that this was Rāvaṇa’s kingdom. This kingdom was, however, destroyed by Lord Rāmacandra.

By studying such incidents, we can understand the full meaning of īśa-vidhvaṁsitāśiṣām. The Lord does not bestow material blessings upon the devotees, for they may be entrapped again in this material world by continuous birth, death, old age and disease. Due to materialistic opulences, persons like Rāvaṇa become puffed up for sense gratification. Rāvaṇa even dared kidnap Sītā, who was both the wife of Lord Rāmacandra and the Goddess of fortune, thinking that he would be able to enjoy the pleasure potency of the Lord. But actually, by such action, Rāvaṇa became vidhvaṁsita, or ruined. At the present moment human civilization is too much attached to economic [development] and sense gratification and is therefore nearing the path of ruination.

Thus, end text 36 - chapter 22 canto 4 Bhaktivedanta translation and purport to Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam in the matter entitled Pṛthu Mahārāja’s Meeting with the Kumāras.

So, when a person, devotee, wants to have a lot of economic development for a comfortable life at the same time hold some desire to serve Kṛṣṇa. Sometimes Kṛṣṇa gives special mercy when he pops the bubble of that illusion that by your economic development, you are going to have some kind of comfortable situation. Because with economic development the material problems don’t end, they simply change. Only by developing Kṛṣṇa consciousness do actual material problems cease. Sometimes a devotee’s with sincere desire for serving Kṛṣṇa wants to have money and use that to serve Kṛṣṇa but then while in the act of making money they may again get into a fruitive attitude and forget their duty to… that actually their purpose was to serve Kṛṣṇa and they get involved into a postponement of their obligations to Kṛṣṇa.

There’s one devotee of Caitanya who was actually quite a poor devotee, he wasn’t very rich, his name was Śrīdhara, his business was selling bananas in Navadvīpa and selling bananas in Navadvīpa is like selling coals in Newcastle because bananas grow everywhere in Bengal. But nonetheless that was his occupation, so if anyone needed any extra bananas then they would buy it from him. So, he would daily take his bananas and his mocha that means thora, the flower in the core of the banana tree to the market and the green plantain so on. And Lord Caitanya’s as small child would go and…he was a brāhmaṇa boy he go shopping for his parents they were doing agriculture he was doing his studies and his father was teaching, so he would buy the banana things from Kholāvecā Śrīdhara and they would always have some discourses. And Lord Caitanya would say “how much is a banana” and he would say “well it's so many conch shell”, those days the money was just little conch shells or kudi’s and that one coin was worth unlimited, I mean just incredible numbers of conch shells you can buy bananas just for few conch shells. But then Lord Caitanya would say “Oh your trying to overcharge”, Kholāvecā said “no ,no ,..you can check the market this is the proper rate” and he wouldn’t overcharge he would always charge the right rate. Then Lord Caitanya would go because Lord Caitanya was a…this Kholāvecā Śrīdhara was actually an eternal devotee of the Lord who came at different pastimes and provided vegetables for the Lord. But…so…at that time Lord Sri Kṛṣṇa Caitanya hadn’t revealed his nature as the incarnation of Godhead in the form of a devotee but in any case, He was enjoying these youthful pastimes with Kholāvecā Śrīdhara and so then he would get into like a little arguing with him ; “no you are overcharging I’m a poor brahmana and your trying to cheat me or trying to take double the price, why don’t you just take the half, take the half price”. Then he’d say “no you check the market I’m only asking the proper price I’m not trying to cheat you”. So, then Lord Caitanya will be looking at the bananas then he throw half the money back and then he’d walk off, “Hey what are you doing come on bring back those banana’s”, Kholāvecā would grab back the bananas and then Lord says “what do you think, you think I don’t want to pay? You're offending a brāhmaṇa?” In this way then Kholāvecā Śrīdhara would get little worried you know the Lord grabbed them back and walked off then…this way they’re having all kind of little daily pastimes between Kholāvecā.

Kholāvecā  was actually blessed in this way by Lord Caitanya because he was a very serious devotee, whatever he would earn he would spend 50% to worshipping the Ganges, that was his particular service to Kṛṣṇa was he’d buy…because he was so poor that his worship meant that he’d buy an incense or a little ghee wick and a few…whatever you know…whatever he has such a small income that 50% will only buy a little bit to worship the Ganges little fruit then he’d offer that to the Ganges and do a little pūjā every morning so…then the other 50% he would maintain his family. In this way he would work in the field and grows bananas and sell them in the market and everyday would chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. So, the local people they would sometimes rather advise him that listen Kholāvecā “why don’t you…you just kind of stagnating here you’re not making any additional money why don’t you just hold of this Ganges worship for a year build up your capital get a little bit more land you know re-invest and then so on and then you can double your profit you can do a big pooja to mother Ganges”. But Kholāvecā Śrīdhara he said “well, if I stop worshipping Kṛṣṇa now then may be after one year things may not work out the way it was planned then I may again postpone and in this way I may not begin again worshiping, I may get out of habit altogether then I’ll lose whatever devotional service I have so this is too dangerous I can’t…I can’t risk it I better just stick to this principle of worshiping every day and I’m working hard if Kṛṣṇa wants to send me more money he’ll send it, I’m working I’m putting in my good days…where whatever income He sends me I’m taking it with that I would worship the Ganges and I’ll maintain my household”. “No but look at your clothes you got holes in it, look at your dhoti it's got holes in it, you could have a good clothe, given a nice saree to your wife and everything well”… “so my cloth has a little hole in it but that at least I have cloth on my body and anyway it’s a little bit cooler in the hot weather”…a little sense of humour there…”but no.. look at your house it's got a hole in it”. “Yes but that allows little sun light to come in in the roof”…”you are crazy”…then he just walked off you know criticising him you know fanatic Hare Kṛṣṇa. So, then Kholāvecā he would chant every night hare Kṛṣṇa with few devotees in his house but then these other materialistic neighbours they would always criticise “why is this guy always shouting out in the night.

Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare

Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare

Someone else said “what do you expect he doesn’t have enough food he can’t sleep he’s just crying for hunger, he’s got belly ache”. So they never gave him a break at all, but he didn’t care he was pretty thick skinned from all these criticisms, but his quite happy chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, serving Kṛṣṇa.

So when lord Caitanya after delivering the Chand Kazi, he and all devotees went to the house of Kholāvecā Śrīdhara because he had very nice garden their mangoes and different trees, it was very beautiful although he was, that’s kind of a contrast, I see them of course in India always giving great propaganda, people are so poor in fact some of the people don’t have a lot of the modern opulences like you know. If they get *too…(Not sure) or something that’s a really big thing, you know a new bicycle but in terms of natural opulence having a beautiful scenery where they live and nice tree’s fresh water actually there in a very…you can drink the water right from the well, it’s a very nice situation in that sense and they get allured sometime.

Prabhupāda went to visit Pānihāṭi on several occasion, on one occasion we were driving to Pānihāṭi from Kolkata and on the road side it’s all industries and basatī’s and slums and it was just horrible and he said 50 years ago we use to come out on this road and these were all what they called Bhagan Bari’s, they were all like country estates of big industrialists and Britisher’s so on very beautiful, very opulent, very…gardens and everything and now it's just like hell. This is the thing he said “they attract the people to come from the village where they have their trees and their cows and their land but they’re not getting a big cash flow but they are self-sufficient”. But they invite them to come in the allurement of getting 600 rupees a month. And then they can work in the factory and then they have to work all day in this hellish situation, nanananana. With all kinds of machines and they live in some slum little compact area so because it's so hellish in their minds they have to drink and when they’re drinking their friends say come on let’s have a game of cards then they gamble away their money. And then their children are running in the street and just getting run over cars and then they’re living in this slum thing and they become antisocial kind of kids because they grow up in this hellish situation. So, where they had this almost heavenly situation in the village but because of... you know various kinds of conditioning and propaganda that you get 600 rupee you know that’s 40 dollars a month you know how much money that is? 40 dollars a month it’s a buck and half a day come on! if you just come and work in this factory in the city. You know in India…in the village only they make only 200 rupees a month so if you get 600, but 600 in the city is nothing. So, in this way people get tricked by Māyā. And there’s exodus from the village to go into the cities. But then it results in morality and everything goes down, crime increases so on.

Prabhupāda was saying we want to preserve the dignity of agricultural and rural life, when Kṛṣṇa and Balarama, specially it's dear to them, Balarama has His plough and Kṛṣṇa has the butter churner. So we want to preserve the dignity of the people of the country that they can be self-sufficient and they can know that it's actually better type of life than living in these hellish cities. So, Kholāvecā Śrīdhara was he was of course that time there wasn’t big industry revolution but neither was he willing to compromise. So when Lord Caitanya took His saṅkīrtana party after the victory over Chand Kazi they all went there and they rested in his orchards. So then Lord Caitanya said that I’m thirsty I want some water, then Kholāvecā Śrīdhara was so poor that he only had kind of a steel pot, a steel cup, it was not actually steel but iron, it was little bit cracked. So, then Lord Caitanya was looking and saw the water pot, saw the iron cups and said “oh there’s that cup” and Kholāvecā goes “no no I’ll go and get a cup from next door they got nice brass ones, this ones is no good”. Of course it’s interesting to know that even a poor man that would use steel or iron and then what was good was considered brass or silver. Nowadays we got aluminium, plastic which they wouldn’t even touch you know even wouldn’t consider as a worthy of using and then those days... Anyway, Kholāvecā he went to try to get the brass so then he saw Lord Caitanya was heading for the iron cup so he went and said “no, no, no don’t take this and he grabbed picked it up and said I’ll get you a good cup don’t worry”, He said, “no no I’m not worried give me that cup that’s quite alright he then...no, no ,no” forcibly grabbed it away from Kholāvecā Śrīdhara. Lord Caitanya 7 feet tall long arms it’s very hard for Kholāvecā you know, can’t reach him. So, then Lord Caitanya took the pot of the water, gulp, gulp and just took some of the water said oh this is the best water I’ve ever had. Lord Caitanya, he would appreciate the determination of different devotees, he had...he appreciated the determination of devotee even though they were materially in difficult times when they wouldn’t sacrifice their devotional service. And He used them as examples look at this person all though materially he is a bit stretched but actually his very happy in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Similarly also of course wasn’t only you have to be like Kholāvecā Śrīdhara, it’s not the only poor persons can engage in devotional service.

But if a person actually thinks if they have that idea in their mind that yes, I’m going to use my wealth for Kṛṣṇa but it’s actually the wealth which is going to make me happy then Kṛṣṇa may pop that bubble, it's not wealth that makes people happy. Its Kṛṣṇa consciousness that makes people happy. Yes, it's their own spiritual satisfaction that makes someone happy, material things can only provide certain comfort which provides certain anxieties and so on so forth and ultimately due to those attachment we lose the things then we are more frustrated. We have a nice situation when it gets disturbed then we get more frustrated.

So voluntarily devotees live in a simple way, they don’t want to expand beyond necessity their material situation because by expanding that simply expand headaches and later on the anxieties and troubles. Of course in some situations the person may be like Yudhiṣṭhira, he was the emperor of the world what choice did he have Kṛṣṇa said, “I want you to manage the world”. So to be the emperor, he had to have a palace wasn’t like you can live in a grass hut, you had to have an army had to have elephants, had to have soldiers, had to have taxes, ministers and so many things. Similarly there were devotees of Lord Caitanya who had all types of material facilities. But those who were truly detached to those facilities and used them in Kṛṣṇa’s service they were considered the pure devotees. The others, for instances even Lord Caitanya one time criticised Hiranya mazumdar and Govardhan mazumdar the two, the father and uncle of Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī, they were very rich people, they pay alone in taxes to the Government, 1 million 2 hundred thousand gold coins. I mean even today that hundreds of millions of dollars, what to speak of that time. That was just the tax they paid not considering the profit they make. So they didn’t always pay their taxes exactly [chuckle]  that’s same thing is today. So, but they were always attached like when Raghunātha dāsa wanted to become a devotee they opposed it. They said no you can have the wealth and stay here and do a little puja to Kṛṣṇa you don’t have to become a… you don’t have to fully dedicate yourself to serving Kṛṣṇa. And, in various ways although they were overtly doing devotional service, they were actually very attached to the material situation in a point of, where there was choice between the two they would always choose the material side. So, Lord Caitanya called them vaiṣṇava-prāya… they were almost Vaiṣṇavas. They weren’t completely sold out on Kṛṣṇa, I mean they were overtly always wearing tilaka and they doing everything, but they weren’t completely dedicated to Kṛṣṇa to that extent. So He considered them to be almost Vaiṣṇavas not pure Vaiṣṇavas.

So, another contrast there Puṇḍarīka Vidyānidhi, who was a rich landlord always had servants, he was carried around in a palanquin, because that was the way of mode of travel, in those days for a landlord for big Zamindar or a Lord but actually he was completely attached to Kṛṣṇa and he wasn’t really…somehow or another he had this wealth, he didn’t artificially renounce it, he simply used it for Kṛṣṇa but actually he was attached to it, it’s not that person had wealth and they voluntarily just put it in the river to show some kind of detachment.

Detachment, comes on how it’s used whether it’s used for sense gratification or used for the pleasure of Kṛṣṇa. In the case of Mazumdar, they used it for both, so Lord Caitanya gave them their prompt and they were Vaiṣṇava-prāya, they were almost pure Vaiṣṇavas because they didn’t use it for only Kṛṣṇa consciousness, They also beyond what they needed to they kind of patted their situation beyond what was actually necessary to do.

Even if it wasn’t overtly, but at least in their own consciousness they were actually very…grew attached to that situation to the extent when their one of their sons wanted to serve, they always tried to obstruct him. And they always kept this materially…even though he was a sannyāsī they would send him money and say here have a nice situation here have a nice situation, their consciousness was very much…instead of encouraging him to be a devotee, in that sense they were encouraging him all kinds of nice comfortable situation. And you know, do your devotion but you know this is a little bit for you, the normal kind of materialistic parental welfare consideration.

So, Lord Caitanya and …[Not sure 36:00] after when …he didn’t obstruct Raghunātha dāsa for two years was taking money from his parents was inviting Lord Caitanya over feeding him prasāda. After two years suddenly, Raghunātha dāsa stopped doing that, Lord Caitanya said why you stopped doing that?

Well, I was thinking why am I taking money from my relatives and then feeding you it’s not my money. And you know I’m feeling proud, I’m giving you food prasādam and all that but actually it’s not the proper attitude. Now, that I have taken the renounced order I should simply, I should be self-sufficient, not take money from my parents like that and just depend upon Kṛṣṇa and serve you. Whatever I get from my own side since I’ve taken this particular order. And then Lord Caitanya said “yes that’s correct”, then he at that time he started saying that actually your father uncle they’re almost Vaiṣṇava. But they’re not pure Vaiṣṇavas and since you’ve taken this renounced order then why remain dependent on the family.

So, Lord Caitanya he would have…I mean it’s very complex in the sense that there is a varṇāśrama situation and one hand Lord Caitanya would be very strict with those who were in celibate, renounced order who would renounce their family connections in the sense of their daily activities. And He will deal with probably differently with those who were married and have wife and children he sometimes name the children, he would sometimes even order them to have children. If they were hesitating and saying “no, I want you to have a child the child will be a devotee”, blessed them. So many things so depending on a particular persons situation there would be different obligations and different utilisations. But the basic principles they remain the same but its sometime very difficult on how to apply them in a particular situation. That requires great sensitivity therefore one takes a spiritual master whose was able to adjust the different environments and see how a person’s particular situation can be best used to advance the cause of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Or how a person in their particular consciousness can gradually advance in Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Prabhupāda, He was always critical of people that when they wanted to engage in devotional service they had this idea that all material energy is bad. So therefore now, I’m going to be a devotee so now let me renounce all my material energy. And then come to Kṛṣṇa without all the material things and then he said that “people work hard their whole life they accumulate some wealth due to their…it’s like their transformation of energy, it’s like we take coal or hydroelectric power and we turn it into electricity. So they ‘ve put their live’s work accumulated as many and they give it away to all their relatives for sense gratification. And then they come Kṛṣṇa empty handed, he said what is that?”

He said principally they should give some for their relatives and they should give some also for Kṛṣṇa and they should keep some for themselves for emergency. If they’re going to be in the renounced when someone else wealth it’s not that we cannot give to Kṛṣṇa but then there’s a certain formula. And one is supposed to give certain amount to Kṛṣṇa and certain amount they can use for their own maintenance, maintaining whatever particular standard of living they have, without unnecessarily increasing at the same time without abruptly giving up.

Prabhupāda, gave another example how one time there was a famous freedom fighter called Lala Babu, I believe his name was maybe I’m wrong but it was Lala Babu. And he was a follower of Gandhi and Gandhi he was very wealthy but Gandhi criticised him saying you have so much wealth you should renounce everything. So he renounced everything and tried to follow Gandhi you know walking in the loin cloth and the stick and then become very austere. But within one year he died, it was such an abrupt change for him to go from very comfortable material living to suddenly go on become just like a mendicant in the street. That just the shock was too much for him then he died due to this being such an abrupt change.

So, on another hand there was this brāhmaṇa in Kūrma Deśa and he approached Lord Caitanya and said, “I want to renounce the world, give up my family, give everything up simply follow you. I’m sick of this saṁsāra life of all the headaches of material life simply want to join you.” Lord Caitanya blasted him and said, “Never say this again, never do I want to hear this word from your mouth, you must stay here and that’s where He said that famous verse”.

yare dekha tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa'-upadeśa,  āmāra ājñāya guru hañā tāra' ei deśa

My dear brāhmaṇa you stay here, and you teach everyone your family your village you teach all of them about Kṛṣṇa, you become a guru and you deliver your land here. This was the order of Lord Caitanya, don’t think about giving up all this material…whatever you have, use that in the service of Kṛṣṇa, You preach Kṛṣṇa consciousness is here, don’t think about giving up. Lord Caitanya didn’t like the idea of negative renunciation; this is considered dry renunciation. You think that all this material energy is bad that we give it up, so many discussions are giving here but actually if we go into it you know in a more sensitive manner, this is we should accept that these states of life have no permanent existence. In other words, a person shouldn’t become infatuated because it’s like I got some material situation and now I’m safe. Now I don’t have to surrender to Kṛṣṇa, in fact this happened.

I had a disciple in South America who was fairly good devotee seemed, he was doing his service. And suddenly he got inheritance from his parents 15 thousand dollars which in that country is like a lot of money, when he got the money he fell in māyā, he thought now I was…I became a devotee because I didn’t have anything now I got this now I can enjoy, he took the money and he went in the prostitutes and drunk and just blew his money completely fell down just like a worm in the…worst situation. And then you know once you start getting into that type of thing, money goes like anything. So, year later he comes back completely destroyed he had no more money, no more friends everyone leaves him you know got stolen and beaten whatever so then he wants to be a devotee. But, now he’s hardly got any determination he’s completely like basket case after surrendering to Maya.

So, you can see that… and this happens sometimes a person may think that well, material life is so bad better to be a devotee. But in their heart, they may think that If I had a nice material facility then I’d be happy. If Kṛṣṇa gives them this facility then it's like a test. Test, that comes sometimes misfortune, sometimes we get fortune. If someone gets good fortune, “I have to use… these are the things I have to do…like use this for Kṛṣṇa, I can also get this…”. Some amount of material facility can be used but if a person gets too attached to that  then when they get it they get too attached to it they forget everything. And they don’t use it for Kṛṣṇa and as a result they get entangled.

So, the special purport here, this says we should know that material situation has no permanent existence. Therefore, we shouldn’t think that oh because I have a comfortable situation therefore now I don’t have to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, all these are kind of materialistic ideas. We can become Kṛṣṇa conscious from any position. Lord Caitanya’s advice was to do yukta-vairāgya, you work, you do your duty, you do your honest labour and according to the results you get the fruits you get according to karma or blessing of Kṛṣṇa that you accept. And accordingly you use part for your material upkeep and use part for Kṛṣṇa. Under the guidance of the spiritual master. In another words always keep your spiritual life…its yukta-vairāgya meaning you use what you need to be healthy, to be able to exist body and soul together and the rest whatever if there’s any surplus at all of course for some people there hardly any surplus but if there is any then you… or could be as dedicated as Kholāvecā Śrīdhara. He used a very rigid formula but somehow or another he used energy for Kṛṣṇa, never give up your top priority is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If your top priority is material comfort and second priority is do something for Kṛṣṇa then its Vaiṣṇava-pray, is almost a pure devotee. But if someone’s top priority is to be Kṛṣṇa consciousness and second priority is…or you know, with that just…of course you cannot do anything unless you're alive. So you have to eat you have to clothing and so on. So your first priority can always say is to live and be Kṛṣṇa conscious. Living without Kṛṣṇa conscious is not acceptable but we can live and be Kṛṣṇa conscious in any circumstances. It’s not difficult, but then we have to adjust any additional things that come. We have to see our priorities that we should use it in such a way that it advances ours and the cause of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And in this case if a person really does that they’re considered as good as a sannyāsī.

We don’t expect everyone is going to do that, because if someone does it they’re as good as sannyāsī. Just like, King Ambarīśa, he was doing that so when Durvāsa muni came and tried to kill him with his curses and mystic powers, instead Durvāsa had to run for his life. Because everything was bounced off Ambarīśa and came back to attack him. Because although overtly Ambarīśa Mahārāja was a householder living in a material world he was a king but actually he had dedicated his whole existence in serving Kṛṣṇa. So, overtly whatever opulence he had was simply for the purpose of making his kingdom Kṛṣṇa conscious. So, he wasn’t recognized by Durvāsa, Durvāsa though he’s a normal attached householder and when he tried to attack him he was actually protected by Kṛṣṇa. Because he was in fact not a ordinary householder also overtly you can’t see, it's very difficult. Just for an ordinary person to see they may be two houses, one may be Kṛṣṇa conscious and one may be in total illusion but there’s a difference. Because, one is the purpose to please Kṛṣṇa and the other purpose is to simply please themselves.

So last night we were discussing some people get afraid, this verse is actually interesting because last night it was brought out that some people in India are afraid to worship Viṣṇu because they hear this

yasyāham anugṛhṇāmi
hariṣye tad-dhanaṁ śanaiḥ

that if you worship Kṛṣṇa or Viṣṇu you’ll lose everything. So, they are afraid so then they criticise in different way., “no if we serve Kṛṣṇa, then he’ll take everything away”. In fact in South India, its very common [Guru Mahārāja is mocking style] ‘Why you worshiping Kṛṣṇa, he’ll take it all away, you should worship just Śiva, don’t worship Kṛṣṇa’. So, there’s even one…came out that some people they may be so afraid that of losing something by worshiping Kṛṣṇa so they may become critical about Kṛṣṇa conscious movement. That we follow these people then we have to give something up. But in this verse, actually the point is that whether they give to Kṛṣṇa or not eventually they’ll lose it anyway. It's simply matter of time, better…if you know you going to lose it then better to give it, then you don’t lose, if you are going to lose something, it’s a kind of a joke in Bengal, how the man was carrying puffed rice on his head and a big wind came up and blew all the puff rice into the air, so at that time it's going to be scattered all over, he can’t use it any more. So, before it hits the ground then he said ‘om govindāya namah’ Oh puffed rice in the air, I offer you to Govinda! [Devotees laugh] it’s a normal thing is that when people their going to lose something. Always tell them to say that the government just acquired our land because we exceeded the ceiling or because we didn’t pay our back tax so we would like to donate it to Kṛṣṇa. But then it's already too late sometimes. But that’s a normal time when they come to us at… we like to donate our land, it's just been occupied by thirty communist and we would like to give it to you. You can… all you have to do is get them off and you can have it. There are so many things like this happened.

But actually, here the advice is given that whether…don’t wait till it’s already being destroyed because sooner or later you're going to lose everything anyway it's going to be destroyed. So, by the supreme controller, so actually if we know that then better to use it for Kṛṣṇa now. Then whatever we have actually takes on permanence because whatever’s part of the sacrifice for Kṛṣṇa that itself becomes spiritual. So actually, Prabhupāda he was very kind he said that householders they have a good opportunity to serve Kṛṣṇa. They can use their house for preaching, and we found that just that I mention there was a…maybe I didn’t mention here but in New Orleans, how there was one person in the Brazil and he was very inimical to the devotees but by associating with people outside the temple he purchased some set of books and actually became favourable. Still he hasn’t come to the temple, there some people who are afraid to come to the temple. They find it like another world, deities and the chanting and some people even think that kartālas are too loud and it’s just…it’s a big change for them, incense smell…whatever it is they’re not able to relate to it. They’re not…they don’t have enough spiritual credit to take advantage of the spiritual atmosphere in the temple.

So Prabhupāda said the householders can use their homes to preach to people, bring them over for dinner, have a nice informal chat. Then at the end kind of say we’re happy family, we’re Kṛṣṇa conscious, it's a good way of life, why don’t you also practise a little Kṛṣṇa consciousness and chant, and whole family can chant together. It’s not like our purpose is to break up families, rather we like it when the whole family is Kṛṣṇa conscious. I never seen a family that is totally Kṛṣṇa conscious stay…unnecessarily break up rather they stay together. Its when one person is trying to force the other person not to be Kṛṣṇa conscious and it creates a whole kind of tension. Or when someone is not patient and one person is gradually coming into it but trying to hurry it up faster than the person can take these types of things cause a little bit of stress. But if everybody is basically favourable to devotional service then even Lord Caitanya, Prabhupāda…there’s is no need of even no need of considering at all taking up sannyasa or renouncing the family situation. I have heard Prabhupāda say many times, in fact sannyāsa is not at all recommended in this age. We’ve had certain bad experiences recently in the Madhva sampradāya in south India they’ve had a few problems. Its very difficult in this age, its much more secure and recommended to be a householder in the long run. Our purpose, ultimate purpose Prabhupāda wanted us to do is establish varṇāśrama dharma he said “I’ve done half the work”. He made temples he made brāhmaṇas, made Kṛṣṇa conscious communities. But then he said he wanted to expand it, wanted to have varṇāśrama, wanted to have the whole society basically more and more Kṛṣṇa conscious that means there will be many Vaiṣṇava pries, there will be many almost Vaiṣṇava, everyone will not be a pure Vaiṣṇava. There will be some people who are materially attached and they’ll be able to guide them, there also need for pure Vaiṣṇava living in the society to show a good example. And to gradually bring them around to the proper standard of Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

And in the …as I mention I think it was last night, how in Chile there was actually this one family that’s sells cars and they were all chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, the whole family so their mission is also they’re going to try to bring in other people of their economic level and to gradually take up the practice of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. So, South America people are interested in yoga, they’re interested in meditation things like that. It's an involved type of thing, possibly they’re little more interested in things like that the many of the older Americans here. The younger Americans from the baby boom in the 30’s they have in the past have shown quite interest in these types of things and it’s a good opportunity if we are able to make them adequately understand the principles of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And they can practise from their homes, from their own situation that we can have many people become liberated from this material illusion, from material suffering. And be able to develop their pure Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Prabhupāda told me personally that don’t expect everyone is going to live in the temple, the temple’s will have required devotees and they’ll be so many people living outside, who will be practising and coming on weekends and coming on special days, but they’ll be chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa at their homes. He told me that in 1970, before sending me to India, of course living in India, there you see so many millions of people worshipping Kṛṣṇa in their home. Some in pure devotion and most of them in almost devotion, pure devotion. But at least they’re worshiping and eventually to have a type of spiritual varṇāśrama in the west. At least the people first have to become somewhat devoted.

I was very encouraged when I read the Caitanya-Caritāmṛta and the description of Lord Caitanya’s tree, there Lord Caitanya described his tree as having so many branches, twigs and leaves and Prabhupāda explained that Kṛṣṇa conscious movement is one of the branches of Lord Caitanya’s tree. So, in the description Lord Caitanya said that who are the branches, he said they are the disciples, the grand disciples in the disciplic succession. And then he said there’s also the pra-śiṣya, śiṣya means disciple and pra means again we used that several times today, almost. Almost disciples, or followers, admirers, well-wishers, friends, there many, they’re also part of Lord Caitanya’s tree. Lord Caitanya accepted those even before they were initiated, but if they’re aspiring or if their well-wisher, if they are associating with the society, they also consider them as part of His spiritual movement. So, that was very encouraging that even the very neophyte Namahaṭṭa folk members were also were given this blessing by Caitanya Mahāprabhu that they were part of His spiritual tree, they were actually blessed by Him.

Prabhupāda wrote a very long purport here because in his own life he felt very strongly about this particular topic in His own writings. And occasions he revealed that personally he felt that…because He was somewhat successful in His business that Kṛṣṇa at the end not taken away little bit of His material situation. He might’ve delayed in surrendering completely in other words the material situation is a bit that affects one and sometimes one gets into the affairs of. From His point of view out of humility he took it that Kṛṣṇa had helped him by revealing certain things, when His wife sold His Bhagavad-gītā manual scripts and used papers to buy 50 cents worth of tea. And when certain things happen they kind of revealed to him that futility of just remaining at that age 56 in His family and trying to practice Kṛṣṇa consciousness when His family members were not at all co-operative. So, then he decided to take vānaprastha after some years he took sannyāsa so that he at the age of 59 he was preaching. So in his particular situation, his wife and family they didn’t cooperate but that was Kṛṣṇa’s desire. Otherwise may be it would’ve been difficult for him to travel all over the world and spread Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if he had remained in the family, so that was His particular dharma, his particular desire, Kṛṣṇa desired for Him that gave us opportunity of having Srila Prabhupāda coming to the western world. And all over the world, he turned back to India to spread the Kṛṣṇa conscious movement all over the continents. Although Prabhupāda did say that at the same time, it’s not like everyone has to take sannyasa, if someone is in a proper Kṛṣṇa conscious situation they can practise Kṛṣṇa consciousness there. But it’s a natural desire that someone may desire. I want to do more devotional service just like Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, he wanted to take sannyāsa, he thought, I should take sannyāsa, but when he went to his guru, His guru said, “no your already better than a sannyāsī”. You see, some people take sannyāsa but they think what I’m missing if I was a householder I would have nice comfortable life  then what is the point of sannyāsa then your fallen. Better if the person is sannyāsī living with wife and family and children but his thinking it would be nice if I was renounced but…so… I’ll be able to give more time to Kṛṣṇa that person's mind is always in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. But in actuality Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura is thinking like that but His guru said, “no you are using everything for Kṛṣṇa, your better than a sannyasi, you are not attached to gṛhastha, you should just go on doing your preaching”. So every person's dharma is different and we can go on discussing this topic for months. It's already late, but it’s important to have understanding about our vision, because normally when we discuss, we discuss either one angle or the other so in this particular verse Prabhupāda also discussed it from different angles. Are there any questions?

(Devotee speaks)

The point is that in this verse what is stated is that material situation should be considered as relative, it's not an absolute situation. Whether one is material failure or whether one is a material success depends on the ultimate issue. The material situation should be considered as simply a relative situation. If a person actually accepts Kṛṣṇa consciousness then that’s eternal, that’s absolute. If the material situation was an impetus that well that’s good, anything that’s impetus our being Kṛṣṇa consciousness is good. The real test is whether a person is absolutely dedicated that’s why some people they may come out of poverty, they maybe in distress, they came to Kṛṣṇa consciousness then Kṛṣṇa may alright here’s your inheritance then the person. Here the heritance now alright so this is how I use it up discuss with spiritual master maybe I buy something for Kṛṣṇa or use this, or maybe now I can…all right use this much for my family and ultimately discuss and deal with it responsibly. And then… so then there’s no material entanglement for that, there’s no karma but instead the person, wow I was before suffering and now Kṛṣṇa I got this wealth now I don’t need Kṛṣṇa, now let me go out and get drunk or something then it’s a big fall down, so that kind of test may happen. When Bali Mahārāja had everything taken away, his wife came and said, “we know this is your special mercy, you take everything away from the devotee, my husband was filled with false ego so you cut down his ego very grateful for this benediction. You given to my husband and then Viṣṇu, he let so many people speak but when she spoke he didn’t wait, he kind of cut her right of and said, “listen don’t think this is my highest mercy, this may be a special mercy but this is not, this is not the jackpot, this is not the top mercy.  This is not the top mercy that I have to offer, you could consider a person who has all kind of material opulence but doesn’t have false ego is not attached to that, that he is possessing my special mercy”. Someone actually…so the real ultimate or absolute are we generally when someone is wealthy and they…someone is better off materially and they sacrifice, we consider that more superficial relative viewpoint, we consider that very glorified but today we are just discussing its getting right down to very cutting off the hairs. That…I mean if someone has something and then they give that’s very auspicious. We can say that’s more glorified, and overtly generally we offer respect to that but the ultimate issue, I mean the ultimate, the final grade when…whether we go back and get pure Kṛṣṇa consciousness or not whether we develop love for Kṛṣṇa or not. Ah.. Kṛṣṇa does see that…what attachments is a person holding so that even a person they if they have something and they give. They themselves shouldn’t be personally satisfied with that but they should rather be always trying to refine their consciousness whatever I do have that in the consciousness this is also the ultimate property of Kṛṣṇa. I have to use it in a responsible way. It’s not that I give Kṛṣṇa this much and the rest I can just use for sense gratification. That’s a general attitude I’ll give Kṛṣṇa something then like I’m paying him off then I can use the rest for whatever I want but that’s not pure devotion, that’s…may appear like pure devotion externally but it's almost pure devotion. Pure devotion means I give to Kṛṣṇa but then what I do have also you should use that in a responsible way. Not that I give Kṛṣṇa donation now I can eat meat, I give Kṛṣṇa donation but I should still eat prasadam, I should still offer, attend Mangal Arti or chant my japa and do my other devotional service. I should use it there…I mean this is very common sense should understand that or maybe I didn’t exactly get your point.

Well a person that’s comfortable, generally doesn’t come to Kṛṣṇa in distress although sometimes in the modern world do even though they have material wealth, maybe their family life is so disturbed. Or their income tax is after them, they may come out off distress even though they may not come out of economic development, they maybe distressed. Generally, people who are more materially really comfortable they come out of inquisitiveness, just like there was a person that came here because he’s never been here before he wanted to see what’s all about. He came here, he didn’t stay for the class, he had something else to do, but some people come because they’re inquisitive what’s it all about? What are these Hare Kṛṣṇa’s up to or someone may get a book, they study it they come out of knowledge. So whatever reason a person comes that auspicious, we find that, usually when people that have some material well-being their generally a bit proud. They feel that you know…it's harder to get them to surrender, which is a greater surrender. Even if a person has very little, they’re still very attached, they still think I got something.

 Prabhupāda use to use example sitting in the Howrah Train station in Kolkata, watching some kind of garbage picker is carrying a huge pile half burnt firewood under head in a bundle of  sweating, struggling with his big bundle and then Prabhupāda pointed out look at the person carrying half burnt firewood which anyone else they threw it away, it was useless.  Even here we have good logs which I save, cut up and save for the winter, for the fire wood but she couldn’t use any last night in the fireplace. But here we just put it in the garbage pile and let them take it away. So for us even good wood is garbage but in India even half burnt firewood is like valuable for someone so the person who is struggling. So Prabhupāda used it as an example all the person got ripped clothes, he’s dirty he’s carrying half burnt firewood you could say he has got nothing. But this not actually, he’s got his firewood, his struggling with it that means to him it has some value, if you try to go there and take it from him, probably get into huge fight with him. So even though he has almost nothing he still has something, it’s something, he is not ‘niṣkiñcana’, so a person may have so much materially but if in his heart he thinks it’s all Kṛṣṇa’s, ultimately I can't take anything with me so whatever is here is a gift of Kṛṣṇa and he is in that consciousness, then he’s ‘niṣkiñcana’. So niṣkiñcana doesn’t mean that you have to become a beggar like that, but ‘niṣkiñcana’ means whether you have a little or lot, you are in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So even a person like that even you tell him to surrender to Kṛṣṇa he’s thinking no I got my fire wood, I got my this I got my that, I got…he still has his attachments.

But generally may say well…in our temple it’s a nice situation some people come because we offer them a nice situation but even then, even if we offer them, better food, a nice plate, still because his not surrendered to Kṛṣṇa they don’t come. You get some but they don’t want to serve, they just think I come in the āśrama for an easy life. In India some people have the idea that you come and live in an āśrama means you don’t have to work just sit with few beads and have a good life and eat a big pile of rice. And we tell them this is not the type of āśrama we have, we work in the fields, we have Gurukul schools, we have our constructions we have our art department, we have our dairy department, you have to come here you have to work here 16 hours a day, for Kṛṣṇa 6 hours, sleep 2 hours eating. Practically you know these our activities for devotional service and so then the people don’t want to come. They rather be lazy and sit and just do nothing and but have their little bit of independence. Generally we get educated people, generally we get people who are little bit intelligent even though we offer you get a free meal but you don’t generally get those type of people they don’t want to come and surrender.

So, theoretically you think that poor people could join easier you know you don’t get the really wealthy people very easy, there really…can say…I mean they…there a little bit proud. But somehow you don’t always get…you don’t even get probably poor people all the time either. Its only if somebody has a little bit of…Kṛṣṇa consciousness is pretty subtle, it's pretty sublime, generally it takes…you can get anybody from any sphere.

But…I said that once to Prabhupāda that will provide this nice facility and it’ll be just like throwing grains in the park all the birds will come and eat it so you know, Prabhupāda said, “it's not like that, they have to have the sukṛtī unless they have the good fortune then they can’t come”. So it’s not just a material thing that people come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they like to think that, people always criticise – ‘yeah he became Kṛṣṇa…he became a sannyāsī because he was too ugly to get married’ [devotees laugh] No one would have him or ‘he rejected the world because he was a failure’ this is a general thing that people say. There may be people who take to renounce life like that but generally to actually to surrender to Kṛṣṇa requires some little bit of special mercy.

A little bit of poverty trains one up although not voluntarily trains one up into renunciation, it can help. So we respect it if someone wealthy and engage in Kṛṣṇa’s service, it’s more of an sacrifice, that’s why in India when the devotees from America come they say ‘you had everything, you had wealth, the good life and you’ve given it all up, we cannot give it up, you’ve given it up’ so they respect the pious people. They respect when people from the west, England or America engage in devotional service they see that living in very austere lifestyle, preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness they respect that. So, we always respect it’s a natural Vedic custom to respect renunciation. But that’s a bit superficial but that’s our custom, we follow that social custom, whose ever more renounced we respect, we overtly give more respect to sannyāsī or brahmacārī. Because they are supposed to be more renounced, but in higher spiritual viewpoint even though a gṛhastha maybe offering a respect like Ambarīśa Mahārāja was offering respect, but actually in his heart he was more renounced than Durvāsa Muni. Although as a gṛhastha he was giving social respect to Durvāsa Muni who was a brāhmaṇa and a kṣatriya. In actual sense of it Ambarīśa was more spiritually advanced, so one thing is that our social custom and how we respect people who have something and they gave… naturally we respond to that is somebody gives, we give them respect, they are our life member, we give them respect.

But in the ultimate our giving respect is one thing but Kṛṣṇa’s little score card is another thing, so a person’s actual advancement of Kṛṣṇa consciousness will be gauged more than just that. But overtly that’s our custom and that certainly Kṛṣṇa also considers that if you have something and you give it up that’s… you’ve given something so you get credit. If you don’t have anything you don’t give anything you don’t get any credit but if you have something then you can give. But they also say that if you have something little and you give something then you get proportionate credit. The person has one rupee and gives 50 paisa or a person has a million rupee and gives ten rupees then who's going to get more credit? So, but if a person has good material fortune, we like to try to get them to be Kṛṣṇa conscious because they have done pious activity in the past. And therefore, they must have some pious nature if they can get over their false ego and become Kṛṣṇa conscious that’s going to be really beneficial for them. That’s the only thing that’s missing, they have already seen the material success which is going to eventually get destroyed. So save them whilst their on the upswing, save them while they have a little better intelligence. Better situation and then they can use that energy for Kṛṣṇa also that will help others to come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It was given by Kṛṣṇa so it should be used for Kṛṣṇa. Any other questions?

Well we have an Ambarīṣa, Ambarīṣa Dāsa, the grandson of Henry Ford. The point is that he has some millions of dollars, he invests that money. If you give all the money just like that then what would he do. Then he wouldn’t have anymore money but by investing money, makes money so he take it and invests it and every year he makes profit and from that profit he donates most of his profit. Doesn’t really building up his capital as such, I don’t know its personal finance. I know that he has a regular budget whatever profit he makes he gives a line shares of that for different ISKCON projects. Last year he purchased a two million dollar building in Manhattan don’t know if we’re going to use it. But…so that’s the point that a person has a particular occupation, if he by giving he has no more occupation, if he is a householder then it’s very difficult.

So all these things are generally balanced by having a spiritual master and he gives advice, he guides the life of a disciple. Otherwise It’s very difficult some people may fanatically says, “yes you should just renounce everything”. But then a person renounces everything and that’s also wasn’t recommended by Lord Caitanya. You abruptly change your situation and then just like that example I gave the person dies I mean it’s too difficult and they can’t maintain. So Lord Caitanya didn’t He said from whatever position you are in use that position to service Kṛṣṇa it’s not that you have to change your situation to be a devotee but rather you use and this was the advice of …at the end of life one may consider whether to be more renounced or  to take vānaprastha, husband wife simply engage in devotional service without having anymore sex life.

We read in America how they have heart transplant at 75 years old and after that heart transplant he goes into the newspaper and says now because I got this new energy from the heart transplant, I’m so healthy, what makes you feel so healthy? I know I’m healthy because I just had sex with my wife so I’m very healthy. I didn’t have that for year so he’s 75 years old, ready to die, almost dead, just had a heart transplant and the first thing he does he gets a little energy he gets sex life. So this is like completely just inconceivable to the spiritual, to the Vedic idea of life the persons ready to die and prepare for his next life. After certain age even though they may have the physical capacity but husband wife should agree that alright we don’t need to have anymore sex life. Now let’s try to use the last period of our life to gradually become little more spiritual and that’s considered vānaprastha. They still live together, they’re instead of cultivating that attitude they cultivate friendship and they try to develop more in their spiritual life. And I mean their goal in the western world is to last breath have a little bit of sense gratification. It’s like eat drink and be married tomorrow we die and its all over. But when we understand that we are eternal and that we have so many different bodies so when we get older it’s an opportunity to become more detached. So like this is, there are so many different examples. But basically your question is a question that isn’t answered in a public thing, it’s a personal thing which depends on each individual.

Raghunātha dāsa wanted to leave his family and Lord Caitanya told him not to leave, told him to be Kṛṣṇa conscious in the family. But later on after some time, He later on gave permission ok at this point you can leave so things may change time to time and that’s why one has a spiritual master. Because then they can see according to particular situation what is the proper thing to do. But the basic principle is that one doesn’t have to renounce everything to be Kṛṣṇa conscious. That is considered dry renunciation that’s rather not recommended suddenly but within one's situation if you have a business, your business has a cash flow, you are making a profit from the profit you serve Kṛṣṇa. Not that you have to sell your business and then if everyone did that how would…what would…then nothing wouldn’t function... That’s not a Varṇāśrama system, that’s totally impractical, in some circumstances a person may be able to do more valuable service for Kṛṣṇa conscious movement. They may be giving so much time and energy for business producing no income then what’s the use of it. You see.. all these things have to be evaluated, what can a person do, what’s a better service?

Svarāpa Dāmodara Mahārāja was a big scientist he could’ve kept on working and making 75 thousand dollars a year and university in LA or something. Whatever..LUS, UCLA or something but instead Prabhupāda had him form the Bhaktivedanta institute. Hadn’t give up science he’s still doing science but instead he was doing it for the Bhaktivedānta Institute. Like things are adjusted not that people change, but in some case there may be more useful or appropriate use for their service. Every devotee should be rather concerned about their own advancement, about their own attitude rather than about the situation of others. They should be concerned about their own personal advancement for that purpose they can take advice…. Changes, should be gradually made, should be made position of strength to strength.

Jagannātha, Balarāma, Subhadrā maiyya ki!  

Devotees: jai!!!

Nitāi-Gaura ki!!! 

Devotees: JAI!!!

Rādhā Madana-mohana ki!!!   

Devotees: Jai!!

END.

Second Level Proofer: Karuṇāpati Keśava das

Second Level Proofed on: 18 October 2020