19940211 Question and Answer Session

The following is a question and answer session given by HH Jayapataka Swami Maharaj on February 11th, 1994 In Balaramdesh.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

If you have a special type of alarm clock that when the time goes you might be insensitive, they may not wake you up, even if it would put a big plate of hot prasadam there, we will be still by your own. But the sound is coming there, that will wake you. So the sense of hearing is always awake, doesn’t turn off. Therefore to get a sound sleep we need peace and quiet. So through hearing, we can awaken our spiritual consciousness and we can get the transcendental knowledge.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) Is that alright? Any other question?

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

Surrender is a comprehensive program, just like we’re surrendering ourselves to your employer to work and he expects that when you are during the working hours you will be giving your intellectual, mental, physical, and full attention to your job. But you are doing that in exchange for some salary, of course depending on the level of responsibility in the job. Like the ordinary worker, he may not have to use so much of intellect, like a delivery boy, that much he has to figure out how to go from here to there and deliver. But if you’re one of the top managers or executives then you may have, you have to give a lot of thought to everything you are doing and put all your, you have to take the responsibility for what you are doing. That’s why they’re suffering stress nowadays, in the management field in many aspects of work, sales, and so on. So that employee, he’s expecting certain, of course, they don’t expect that emotionally. Even in Japan, they want to, even emotionally you should involve really mean behind a company, they want people should be emotionally involved also. But in the British and others to a certain limited extent expect some loyalty also to the company, but maybe not fully emotionally involved but some limited.

 

So you can see that in this material world is like a perverted reflection, people are expecting that type of, almost like a surrender. And some, it may vary from one company to the next but while we’re serving Kṛṣṇa that surrender means that now we are working on behalf of Kṛṣṇa’s interest. This is not just a only mental or only physical, it’s a total commitment to doing that which Kṛṣṇa do, which would be pleasing to Kṛṣṇa, it’s how working on behalf of Kṛṣṇa’s interest. But Kṛṣṇa is very practical, in His idea expect naturally people have to go on with their duties. But He is saying that the duties should be performed for His satisfaction. So, therefore, He created the Varnashrama system so that people on different ashrams like someone’s a brahmacari, a student, a grihastha, renowned, retired life so different duties are given. So for the brahmacaris and sanyasis they are supposed to work simply for the interest of their guru. But for the grihasthas, naturally, they have to maintain their families, their wife, and children, they have social duties as well. So for them, there are different sets of rules, but even as a grihastha, they have the same duties to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, to study Bhagavad Gita, to worship Kṛṣṇa. And there are certain guidelines on how they can lead their life in such a way that they will gradually go back to Kṛṣṇa.

 

So the surrender is that doing the things that Kṛṣṇa wants us to do. Just like when you go to the job, if you start doing things which the company doesn’t want then they all say will complain or they won’t appreciate what you are doing. This is a common-sense thing, so if you are serving Kṛṣṇa this thing we have to do surrendering to Him that means now I’ll do things the way You want. So Kṛṣṇa said, this way you will be a grihastha, this way you'll be a student, this way you will be retired or renounced. You chant My holy names, in your house, you make a deity of Me, you offer your food to Me, everything you do, whatever you give away, whatever you do in such a way that it’s an offering to Me. So there is a, now the job you are only working 8 to 5 or 7 to 1 and 4 to 7 or whatever different, work according to your time period. But to be in serving the Kṛṣṇa is 24 hours a day. But since it’s a long term surrender, so all the other activities can also be fit within that. You can simultaneously be working in your job while you are surrendering to Kṛṣṇa. Because that work is temporary, it’s in a much lower dimension, you are working, you are getting your income, with that income you are maintaining your family. But if the work involves doing something totally, say if the work involves that you are supposed to slaughter animals, then that might be restricted what would avoid doing such a thing. But otherwise, the normal work that we do where we are not directly involved in any sinful activity, then we, we do that with our work, we offer the results to Kṛṣṇa in the way he describes, maintaining your family and helping them in their spiritual life, maintaining our house in the pure way, house becomes an ashram, using any surplus income for Krishna's service. Different ways we can avoid therefore any contact with karma. Because we are working on behalf of Kṛṣṇa then we are not affected by karma. If you are working on our own behalf we have to take whatever the karma we get. But working on Kṛṣṇa’s behalf then there is no reaction.

 

So Arjuna, he was a warrior, he is killing soldiers in the battle but he is not touched by any karma because he’s doing it before Kṛṣṇa. So if we do our activities in order to please Kṛṣṇa, we do it in such a way that Kṛṣṇa’s devotional service is promoted then Kṛṣṇa will take that karma. But if we do on our own behalf then we have to take the karma. Just like there was one, in one country, I have a disciple, he works for the Military police, Intelligence. That means he does kind of a spy, he works for the military police. So every time he has to go, sometimes they tell him that you go and you work in this place, you get a job, you tell us what’s going on. Or you go to this religious institution and sit and listen to the lecture and you tell us if they say anything about the politics or anything, give report, you just go like an ordinary devotee and listen, maybe someone like that you will come (laughing). So, that’s his job! Now he’s assigned by them to go and do so many different things, so he is going and working in all there. But that’s all part of his job, he’s being paid by them. Of course he’s going and he’s getting some other job and, but that’s only because they told him. So I’m using that as an example, we’re working on behalf of Kṛṣṇa, we surrender to Him but, He’s telling us, alright, you have family, you maintain your family, to do that you take a job or you do business or you do this, you do that. But actually we’re not really working for this, that’s just a super temporary arrangement we’re making for our survival. But who we really report, who our supreme boss is, Kṛṣṇa, that is what surrender means.

 

Just like Prahlad, he surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, but being a five year old boy he has to follow what his father says. So what does his father says, Prahlad you go to sleep, you go to school, you get everything. But only when his father told that you give up Kṛṣṇa, then he said, that I can’t do. Being a Kṛṣṇa devotee I surrender to Kṛṣṇa, I’ll do everything you say as a father but if you tell me to give up Kṛṣṇa then that I can’t do. So the devotee makes it clear actually, that ultimately who he’s serving is Kṛṣṇa, that the father didn’t like it. He was an asura, he want only you should serve me, why God? I am God! There’s no higher God than me! Appa Bhagavan, father is God, that was his concept. But Prahlad said no! Your power is coming from the Supreme Lord. So I worship, I’m following you because you are representing the Lord. No no! I am God! There’s no God other than me. If you said there’s another God, let Him come before me otherwise I’ll, he was a very (inaudible 10:54) thief. But actually Prahlad was a very good, he went to school, father said go to school, he went to school. Said you have to hear your teacher, he heard his teacher. He didn’t agree with what he was saying but he listened, he did. Lord Caitanya said that just like if a wife had a lover other than the husband she would do the household activities very carefully not to be detected by the husband that she has another lover. But all the time naturally her mind will be thinking of the other person even though she’ s putting on all the show. So like that we should do our material duty. Anyone see, that they think that this person is so devoted to his activity, very good in his family, business, but they don't know actually only he’s thinking that how can I please Kṛṣṇa ultimately end of this life I want to leave this whole material world and go back to Kṛṣṇa. This is another concept of surrender.

 

That’s why this big rishis they can’t figure out what is the bhakta’s position because superficially they look like anybody else. But actually everything they’re doing, they are doing it as a devotion for Kṛṣṇa. Therefore they’re not on the same status, they’re in another dimension. That's why Durvasa Muni cursed Ambarish and instead the Durvasa Muni had to run because the curse came back on him. Then actually he came back to Ambarish and after going to Brahma, Siva and Vishnu he came all the way back and told Ambarish’s lotus feet and begged him to forgiveness. Said, I didn’t realize that you are just, if you are a bhakta, I didn’t realize what it meant to be a bhakta. Now I understand to be a surrendered soul to Vishnu means you are the most powerful person in the universe, because all the power of Vishnu is with you. And what am I? I was just a yogi and had only limited power from by tapasyas. Against you, I am finished! So, therefore, I’m falling at your feet and begging you, please

 

[Break]

 

… so that you being whatever someone is student or grihastha or whatever they may be, just being householder they can get all the unlimited power of Vishnu simply by this process of dedicating their life for serving the Lord. But from an external viewpoint, they may look like anyone else. That’s why even when Prabhupada went to the western country and he was peaching, the catholic and the protestant the Christian priests they are coming and saying, what you have done to all our children? When they were with us they were just dull faced and they didn’t do much. But now when they come with you, they are bright-faced, they are very active, they have all the good qualities, what you have done? So even visibly they could see that there was a change when the people took to the devotional service.

 

(aside:) Jen, are we clear? Who is the proprietor of your body? Can you say? Who is the owner, proprietor of your body?

 

(devotee:) The sole proprietor is the God, Lord Kṛṣṇa.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) Any other idea? He’s saying that the soul is the owner of the body and the body is, the soul is owned by Kṛṣṇa.

 

(devotee:) Proprietor of this body

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) Kṛṣṇa is the proprietor of this body. They are the owner?

 

(devotee:) They are the components.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) They are the components. Who is the owner of the body?

 

(devotee:) We are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa.

 

(devotee:) I think mind and intelligence and is controlled by the soul.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) Mind and intelligence are the owners of the body?

 

(devotee:) Controlled by the soul.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) But mind and intelligence, do they have any separate existence?

 

(devotee:) No!

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) Then how they can be the owner?

 

(devotee:) Our soul is, soul.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) Soul! So here we have any way two main ideas we are getting are either the soul is the owner or the Kṛṣṇa is the owner?

 

(devotee:) Kṛṣṇa is the owner.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

Of course, so then soul being the owner this would be qualification the soul is owned by Kṛṣṇa? So if Kṛṣṇa is the sole proprietor of the atma then whatever the atma owns that Kṛṣṇa also owns. Didn’t it? So ultimately it’s all Kṛṣṇa’s energy, Kṛṣṇa is saying ‘daivī hy eṣā guṇa-mayī’, this is My divine energy. Actually we’re simply borrowing this body, you can say. We are given, just like you are working for company, they may give you company car. You use the car! Not only say this is my car, I can smash it or I can take and I can do, do the company be happy with that? So actually all of us are having an only company car, this car is given by Kṛṣṇa. But what we are doing is while we are in this material world is because we are misusing the energy Krishan gives us. Am I using it in the way that He doesn’t authorize? If we fully use it the way he prescribes then we get elevation. And if we use it in a way he doesn’t prescribe then we get punishment. If we fully use this in His service then, as a result, you’ll take, you'll exchange this car for one eternal car. He’ll give us back our original spiritual form. We don’t have to go anymore into the cycle of birth and death. That simply if we use this body, the company car, in a way which Kṛṣṇa is prescribing in His devotional service then, as a result, we can go back to Kṛṣṇa. We can leave this temporary car and He gives us our eternal Siddha Swarup or spiritual body.

 

So surrender actually what does it means? Surrender means we understand that this whole material world, this body everything is ultimately the property of Kṛṣṇa. I am the property of Kṛṣṇa, what to speak of what I do then. I am part of Kṛṣṇa, I am atma and I am part of Kṛṣṇa. Being part of Kṛṣṇa what is my function or role but to serve Kṛṣṇa. The hand is part of the body, it will serve the whole body. I am part of Kṛṣṇa, I should serve Kṛṣṇa. When we have that understanding then where is the question of karma? Surrender comes automatically with the proper understanding. If we simply understand what is our relationship with Kṛṣṇa, how we, who we are? Then naturally surrender will be the next step because we’re understanding I am part of Kṛṣṇa, then I will have a separate interest in Kṛṣṇa.

 

(aside:) So any other question? We’ll go to the next question. Yes!

 

(devotee:) Lord Kṛṣṇa says in Bhagavad Gita that whatever worship any demigods then indirectly he is worshipping Me. So He has not, I mean he did not in Bhagavad Gita not clear that whether this catholic religions or muslim religions also somebody owing by the Kṛṣṇa or what?

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

Bhagavad Gita Kṛṣṇa is saying that He gives the faith in the heart. Someone wants to worship Him even directly or indirectly someway then He gives the faith19:07 . So if they’re worshipping indirectly then ultimately it’s meant for Him, He is the only independent Lord. So in that way any kind of religious faith that one has, Kṛṣṇa gives the faith to them. Then based upon they want to have faith they want to worship in a particular way. So in order to allow them, He gives them faith. But they may choose to worship in a correct way, they may choose to worship in an inferior, not a very direct way, but some amount of devotion they have and they want to worship in a particular way. So then Kṛṣṇa fixes their faith, okay you can worship like this. But in Bhagavad Gita He’s saying that, the ideal situation is we should directly worship Him, then they will directly come back to Me. But if they indirectly worship Me then they will get an indirect benefit.

 

(devotee:) But he doesn’t didn’t say in which form He has to be worshipped you know

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami: What do you mean?

 

(devotee:) In which form He has to be worshipped, that isn’t specifically said in the Bhagavad Gita. Any form so and so, for Arjuna, He showed the form of you know, all forms Viswarupa.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami: Viswarupa

 

(devotee:) So there is nothing which is not in it. So when He says, when He shows that whatever forms or there is nothing in the world which is not in there. So He must be showing that everything is His creation or He is Master of all and but He doesn’t say in which form He has to be worshipped.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) You have Bhagavad Gita?

 

Kṛṣṇa is showing the viswarupa, He’s showing how everything is within. But does Kṛṣṇa say that you can worship any of the parts of the universal form? And that is also worship for Me? He said ‘man-manā bhava mad-bhakto’ you bow down to me, you be My devotee

 

man-manā bhava mad-bhakto

mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru

mām evaiṣyasi satyaṁ te

pratijāne priyo ’si me

 

You worship Me, you bow down to Me. So when He showed the universal form He showed how everything is within Him. Then after that Arjuna, he said what, he said now I ask You to take Your four-handed form.

 

adṛṣṭa-pūrvaṁ hṛṣito ’smi dṛṣṭvā

bhayena ca pravyathitaṁ mano me

tad eva me darśaya deva rūpaṁ

prasīda deveśa jagan-nivāsa

 

TRANSLATION:

 

After seeing this universal form, which I have never seen before, I am gladdened, but at the same time, my mind is disturbed with fear. Therefore please bestow Your grace upon me and reveal again Your form as the Personality of Godhead, O Lord of lords, O abode of the universe.

 

kirīṭinaṁ gadinaṁ cakra-hastam

icchāmi tvāṁ draṣṭum ahaṁ tathaiva

tenaiva rūpeṇa catur-bhujena

sahasra-bāho bhava viśva-mūrte

 

TRANSLATION:

 

O universal form, O thousand-armed Lord, I wish to see You in Your four-armed form, with helmeted head and with club, wheel, conch and lotus flower in Your hands. I long to see You in that form.

 

So Kṛṣṇa showed His universal form to Arjuna and then Arjuna he wanted to see the four handed form, chaturbhuja, shanka, chakra, gada, padma, lotus, club, chakra the wheel and the conch shell. So then He took, then the Lord very happily He went from the universal form to the four-handed form. So Kṛṣṇa is saying.

 

TRANSLATION: BG 11.49

 

You have been perturbed and bewildered by seeing this horrible feature of Mine. Now let it be finished. My devotee, be free again from all disturbances. With a peaceful mind, you can now see the form you desire.

 

So then TRANSLATION: BG 11.50

 

The Supreme Personality of Godhead, Kṛṣṇa, having spoken thus to Arjuna, displayed His real four-armed form and at last showed His two-armed form, thus encouraging the fearful Arjuna.

 

The viswarupa is actually considered a temporary form of the Lord. Because the viswa is only manifested sometimes, universe is not always manifested. After the pralaya there is no universe, so there’s no more universal form. Only when the universe is manifested can you see the universal form.

 

(devotee:) After the pralaya we see Kṛṣṇa in, He is as a small child, you know drifting on the water.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

That’s not after pralaya, that’s during pralaya, isn’t it? That you can see. Kṛṣṇa in the baby form you can always see, Kṛṣṇa in baby form is always existing. But universal form, once there’s no more universe, the universe after the pralaya, it goes back into the body of the Maha Vishnu, then where is the universe? Then only the spiritual world is there, only Narayana is there, Kṛṣṇa is there, there’s no more Indra, Vayu, no more, nothing is there, everything is taken out and put into the Maha Vishnu, only the spiritual world is there. That time there is no universal form. But baby form of Kṛṣṇa you can always see because that’s in Goloka Vrindavan, it’s always there and that’s also sometimes visible in material world.

 

[Break]

 

… Four-handed form finally came down to two-handed form. So all this time Kṛṣṇa is speaking then...

 

TRANSLATION: BG 11.51

 

When Arjuna thus saw Kṛṣṇa in His original form, he said: O Janārdana, seeing this humanlike form, so very beautiful, I am now composed in mind, and I am restored to my original nature.

 

Then what did Kṛṣṇa say,

 

śrī-bhagavān uvāca

su-durdarśam idaṁ rūpaṁ

dṛṣṭavān asi yan mama

devā apy asya rūpasya

nityaṁ darśana-kāṅkṣiṇaḥ

 

TRANSLATION:

 

The Supreme Personality of Godhead said: My dear Arjuna, this form of Mine you are now seeing is very difficult to behold. Even the demigods are ever seeking the opportunity to see this form, which is so dear.

 

Actually the form of Kṛṣṇa with two hands is more difficult to see than the Viswarupa. Now the rest of Bhagavad Gita Kṛṣṇa is only speaking with the two-handed form. So and with that form Kṛṣṇa explains, you cannot see this form.

 

TRANSLATION: BG 11.53

 

The form you are seeing with your transcendental eyes cannot be understood simply by studying the Vedas, nor by undergoing serious penances, nor by charity, nor by worship. It is not by these means that one can see Me as I am.

 

nāhaṁ vedair na tapasā

na dānena na cejyayā

śakya evaṁ-vidho draṣṭuṁ

dṛṣṭavān asi māṁ yathā

 

bhaktyā tv ananyayā śakya

aham evaṁ-vidho ’rjuna

jñātuṁ draṣṭuṁ ca tattvena

praveṣṭuṁ ca paran-tapa

 

TRANSLATION:

 

My dear Arjuna, only by undivided devotional service can I be understood as I am, standing before you, and can thus be seen directly. Only in this way can you enter into the mysteries of My understanding.

 

Kṛṣṇa is saying, I am standing before you in my original spiritual form, but this form cannot be realized by studying vedas, by penances, by jnana, by karma, by any means. Only by ‘ananya bhakti’ can you understand Me as I am. This is the most confidential form, ‘Only in this way can you enter into the mysteries of My understanding.’ So very clearly Kṛṣṇa is saying to understand His two-handed form as the Supreme form. Very clear from the Viswarupa chapter. Then He explains here.

 

TRANSLATION: BG 11.55

 

My dear Arjuna, he who engages in My pure devotional service, free from the contaminations of fruitive activities and mental speculation, he who works for Me, who makes Me the supreme goal of his life, and who is friendly to every living being – he certainly comes to Me.

 

Kṛṣṇa is talking about the Lord in the spiritual world, Himself who is always living in the spiritual world. In Brahma Samhita, it very clearly explains

 

(aside:) Where is Brahma Samhita? You know how to chant? Chintamani..

 

(devotee:)

 

cintāmaṇi-prakara-sadmasu kalpa-vṛkṣa-

lakṣāvṛteṣu surabhir abhipālayantam

lakṣmī-sahasra-śata-sambhrama-sevyamānaḿ

govindam ādi-puruṣaḿ tam ahaḿ bhajāmi

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami

(aside:) Next verse

 

(devotee:)

 

veṇuḿ kvaṇantam aravinda-dalāyatākṣam-

barhāvataḿsam asitāmbuda-sundarāńgam

kandarpa-koṭi-kamanīya-viśeṣa-śobhaḿ

govindam ādi-puruṣaḿ tam ahaḿ bhajāmi

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami

(aside:) So what is the translation of that next verse?

 

(aside not clear)

TRANSLATION: Brahma Samhita 5.4

 

I worship Govinda, the primeval Lord, who is adept in playing on His flute, with blooming eyes like lotus petals with head decked with peacock's feather, with the figure of beauty tinged with the hue of blue clouds, and His unique loveliness charming millions of Cupids.

 

ālola-candraka-lasad-vanamālya-vaḿśī-

ratnāńgadaḿ praṇaya-keli-kalā-vilāsam

śyāmaḿ tri-bhańga-lalitaḿ niyata-prakāśaḿ

govindam ādi-puruṣaḿ tam ahaḿ bhajāmi

 

TRANSLATION:

 

I worship Govinda, the primeval Lord, round whose neck is swinging a garland of flowers beautified with the moon-locket, whose two hands are adorned with the flute and jeweled ornaments, who always revels in pastimes of love, whose graceful threefold-bending form of Syamasundara is eternally manifest.

 

So here in this verse it is very clearly this verse is saying tri-bhańga, His threefold-bending form, He is having the two hands holding the flute. It’s very clear what form of the Lord to worship. And from Bhagavad Gita is very clear Kṛṣṇa shows the universal form, then He shows the four-hand, then He is back to two hands. After that he is telling Arjuna to worship Him, to surrender and depend on Him. So through that one can understand that He’s talking about His personal form. The Viswarupa is the kind of impersonal form because it’s having so many different aspects to it, it’s containing everything. So in 12th chapter we were reading, He’s explaining that it’s difficult to fix the mind on the impersonal form. But He is saying it’s

 

TRANSLATION: BG 12.2

 

The Supreme Personality of Godhead said: Those who fix their minds on My personal form and are always engaged in worshiping Me with great and transcendental faith are considered by Me to be most perfect.

 

TRANSLATION: BG 12.3-4

 

But those who fully worship the unmanifested, that which lies beyond the perception of the senses, the all-pervading, inconceivable, unchanging, fixed and immovable – the impersonal conception of the Absolute Truth – by controlling the various senses and being equally disposed to everyone, such persons, engaged in the welfare of all, at last achieve Me.

 

That finally by worshipping impersonal form you can also achieve. But it, what’s He saying?

 

TRANSLATION: BG 12.5

 

For those whose minds are attached to the unmanifested, impersonal feature of the Supreme, advancement is very troublesome. To make progress in that discipline is always difficult for those who are embodied.

 

So there are different paths, all the paths are ultimately leading to Kṛṣṇa. But He’s saying that those who are worshipping Him in His personal form, personal means two handed or four handed? Universal form is a special manifestation. And the impersonal truth is a form of the Lord which is also not different, this is spiritual form but that form is difficult to worship. So Bhagavad Gita directly and indirectly is advising us that it’s better to worship the personal form.

 

(devotee:) (inaudible 33:52)

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

Quoting the heart, second Canto Bhagavatam. So what’s the question?

 

(devotee:) So there He says how he has to be meditated upon not the Kṛṣṇa form, but the Narayana form.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) Okay now you accept that He did Narayana form or Kṛṣṇa form

 

(devotee:) Is recommended

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami: … is recommended in shastra?

 

(devotee:) Yes

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

That Vishwarupa form is only a preliminary meditation. But ultimately shastra is recommending we should go to the personal form. This Viswarupa is the first stage focussed someone who has no faith in God, if they can understand universal form then they, they can see the universe, they can see that all the universal energy is under the Lord so naturally they’ll appreciate His power. Then from that we come up to the personal form. So in second canto Bhagavatam He’s recommending that the yogis, those who are doing the yoga system they are meditating, they are meditating in the Paramatma in the heart. The form of the Paramatma is having four hands. So naturally if you’re meditating on the Paramatma in the heart we will see the Lord with the four hands. That subsequently in later cantos of Bhagavatam is also shows how other great devotees who are not Paramatma yogis doing the meditation. But the other, they are simple even ladies or they were other types of men who are not necessarily experienced in that type of yoga meditation, they also could achieve the perfection simply by worshipping the Lord. But for us you see that when you worship two hand or four hand it’s a lesser question. Because these are the two different forms of the Lord. four handed means the opulence and majesty and two handed means very intimate and personal.

 

So later it describes that Kṛṣṇa’s form is the original form and the form of Narayana is manifestation or expansion from Kṛṣṇa. So if someone wants to worship the Narayana form we have no objection, or if they want to worship Kṛṣṇa from or Rama form or Narasimha form, any form of Vishnu is alright to be worshipped as the Supreme. These are different forms of the same person, He’s only one Lord, he appears in a’’. The next verse Brahmam says ‘ananta rupa’

 

(devotee:)

 

rāmādi-mūrtiṣu kalā-niyamena tiṣṭhan

nānāvatāram akarod bhuvaneṣu kintu

kṛṣṇaḥ svayaḿ samabhavat paramaḥ pumān yo

govindam ādi-puruṣaḿ tam ahaḿ bhajāmi

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) What is the translation?

 

(devotee:)

 

TRANSLATION: Brahma Samhita 5.13

 

I worship Govinda, the primeval Lord, who manifested Himself personally as Kṛṣṇa and the different avataras in the world in the forms of Rama, Nrisimha, Vamana, etc., as His subjective portions.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

(aside:) The other ananta rupa? Anadi anana rupam? 7th one

 

(devotee:)

 

advaitam acyutam anādim ananta-rūpam

ādyaḿ purāṇa-puruṣaḿ nava-yauvanaḿ ca

vedeṣu durlabham adurlabham ātma-bhaktau

govindam ādi-puruṣaḿ tam ahaḿ bhajāmi

 

TRANSLATION:

 

I worship Govinda, the primeval Lord, who is inaccessible to the Vedas, but obtainable by pure unalloyed devotion of the soul, who is without a second, who is not subject to decay, is without a beginning, whose form is endless, who is the beginning, and the eternal purusha; yet He is a person possessing the beauty of blooming youth.

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

So the Lord, he has got unlimited forms just like as the human being we can see that people have got different nature, different aspects to their personality. You may see someone in the office behind the desk he is having one way of dealing. You see him in his house with his wife and family he’s dealing another way. Then you see that he’s in the golf course or something with his other colleagues, he’s dealing another way. We love to see that he is singing some bhajans or doing some dramatic performance. So different environment they act in a different way, different aspects of the personality are manifested, but the same person in the same body. But Kṛṣṇa being the Lord for every environment, for every situation He can assume a different rupa. If He wants to show His anger He can come like a Narasimha deva with a, who can be more ferocious than the tiger or lion? More than the human being, being angry if you see a tiger roaring you become frightened, so He can show His anger as a Narasimha. Or if He wants to show how He can be innocent and He can be like a baby floating on the leaf. Or if He wants to show how everything is within Him, He can show the universal form. Like this, He has so many unlimited forms, but He is only the one Lord. So Bhagavad Gita is recommending, we worship Him in person, and ultimately the form of Kṛṣṇa with two hands is considered to be the best.

 

We got though, Sri sampradaya, they prefer worshipping Narayana and He revealed Bhishmadeva in Bhagavatam lesson, He also wants to, He like the devotee of Narayana. Some people they like to worship the God as Narayana with the four hands. So Lord Caitanya didn’t disturb, if they want to Narayana they can worship. This is one of the forms of the Lord. But sometimes they were telling Lord Caitanya like this that, nobody understands why do you want to worship Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa is the only avatar of Narayana, you should worship Narayana. Why do you say that Narayana is the avatar of Kṛṣṇa? So then Lord Caitanya said, ‘alright, if Narayana is the incarnation of Kṛṣṇa. I mean if Kṛṣṇa is incarnation from Narayana that means Narayana must have everything that Kṛṣṇa had!’ isn’t it? Of course! Then why is it that Lakshmi was doing tapasya to go to the rasa lila of Kṛṣṇa? Why she wasn’t happy with being with Narayana she want to again go to Kṛṣṇa’s rasa lila? Because Narayana doesn’t have the rasa lila, only Kṛṣṇa is having. Then they didn’t know what to say. Then he asked one more question ‘and after doing Tapasya you please tell me why was it that Lakshmi was prohibited that she cannot go to rasa lila? But puranas says normally she did tapasya to go to the Kṛṣṇa’s pastime, well after doing it she was still denied, you cannot come. Say, if she wants the Supreme then why Kṛṣṇa can prohibit her?

 

Parasara muni was the father of Vyasa deva. He did a study of all devas and all the different avatars and forms of Bhagavan mentioned in vedas, in the knowledge that was available at that time. So he came to a study that you can find the 64 principle qualities to analyze everything. Lord Brahma and others, and devas and other jivas like human beings, they can have a maximum 50 of those 64 and Brahma has got the most and the others have minute quantities. But traced all the men(not clear 42:50 ) they may have up to 50 qualities. And they found that Lord Shiva has got the 55 of the 64, he has got five more qualities. Then Narayana is having again five more than Siva does not have, bringing Him up to 60. But only Kṛṣṇa has got all the 64 qualities. Therefore he came to the conclusion that Kṛṣṇa is the complete form of the Absolute Truth, He is the full form of Bhagavan and all the other forms are partial. The Narayana has got 93%, Siva has got 85% and the Brahma has only got 78% of the qualities. But in quantity, quantitative of the Kṛṣṇa is the unlimited quantity and they are having some minute fraction. So like this, there is various evidences. Even in Shiva Purana Shiva is telling to Parvati ‘you chant the sahasra nama of Vishnu, Vishnu is main he said it

 

ārādhanānāṁ sarveṣāṁ

viṣṇor ārādhanaṁ param

tasmāt parataraṁ devi

tadīyānāṁ samarcanam

 

If you worship Vishnu that is the Supreme form of worship and worshipping His, those things connected with Him is even better than worshipping Him. Then she went discussing like that puranas. So again Shiva told to Parvati that if you chant the name of Rama

 

rāma rāmeti rāmeti

rame rāme manorame

sahasra-nāmabhis tulyaṁ

rāma-nāma varānane

 

O my beautiful faced Goddess! If you chant the name of Rama is actually Param Brahma and by chanting the name of Rama, this equals to chanting 1000 name of Vishnu. Then he explained that if you chant the name of Kṛṣṇa the two-syllable “kṛṣ” and “ṇa” also signify the Absolute Truth or Param Brahma. And by chanting the name of Kṛṣṇa then it equals to chanting 3000 times the name of Vishnu or 3 times the sahasra nama of Vishnu. Then this way we have various evidences in the vedas showing how worship of Kṛṣṇa is more effective than the worship of Rama or worship of Vishnu. But Vishnu, Kṛṣṇa, Rama they are all forms of the same Lord but the potency is different.

 

That we being be a most fallen state, to worship Vishnu you have to be very formal, you have to be very correct, where Kṛṣṇa is very kind invacious (Not clear 45:37 ) and, I mean to say Kṛṣṇa is very accessible as a cowherd boy, as a child. So some more compassion is there. So being in a fallen state we need also more compassion, we need the more mercy. We don’t have to do everything exactly correct in the formal way being out of the culture. So it’s easy also to approach Kṛṣṇa, simply out of devotion He’ll accept. Even if formally you make some minor mistake He will overlook that. But if you're approaching the Lord in His formal aspect, then you have to be very correct in everything you are doing. Just like if you go to meet the ruler, you will know all the etiquette exactly how to behave, how to speak, then you take some training code, if you are going to meet in a court. After some time if you can meet in the private area and he’s just come with a friend or something that may be different. So meeting Kṛṣṇa is like meeting in a very private intimate way where it’s not all the formal aspect.

 

(aside:) Any other questions? Yes!

 

(devotee:) When the soul leaves the body is there any signal or indication for that this soul is going to leave the body? My personal experience, when my father expired in December 1982, you know the doctor suggested one needle stunt disturbing his struggle coming in the body for liver and heart connection. So I was working, that time it was the latest in India, I have to get it from states. So better go taking one spare that's giving from another doctor and he’s troubling (47:37 Not clear)for it. So when they were doing this I was going around my father told me some boy going here and there there is no more time for me. So after he was, before dying he was just lying continuously unconscious, in unconscious only he soul left the body. I and my father got one great devotee for Lord, so I don’t, is that signal that you know that indication for everybody or for himself or somebody special devotee problem? That his soul is going to leave the body. For ordinary people also is there any advanced knowledge that he’s going to die?

 

His Holiness Jayapataka Swami:

Those who are born spiritually they’re blessed they get some conscious understanding that time is coming to the end. Natural cause also by material nature sure gives us an indication when we’re about to go, there are certain symptoms. One of the symptoms is old age, as we are getting older we start losing our teeth, we start losing our eyesight, hair fall is out, so we’re gradually given some indication where we’re the atma, we have to leave the body. Truly we are the atma, your father is the soul, your father lost the body. Not that your father had a soul, your father is the soul and this like keep the soul you knew that I’m not here to stay long, don’t bother all these things. In material life we are struggling how to make the body with, just the body and soul together for a short time longer. But when we’re already in old age we know that someday we have to go or someone may get some direct understanding that I’m not to stay long. So that time it’s more important how to simply extend your life, a few days longer or few years longer, for how we can go to the next destination.

 

Prabhupada, he gave the instruction that “when I get sick, don’t take me to hospital. Don’t let them put all the tubes and things in. Don’t try to keep me alive by some light support system. I want to hear the chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and let me go in the association of devotees”. That sometime we may think we are doing a favor by trying to just plan this, that, so many. But at a certain point, there’s no use, there’s no real advantage. More important, let the person go to the next birth, give a better door to the next life then remember Kṛṣṇa while he’s going. Then people have the proper understanding of who the person is. The person is not the body, the person is the soul and the consciousness is symptom of the soul. Your soul leaves body, soul never dies. So if we can remember Kṛṣṇa while we leave the body then we go back to Kṛṣṇa. So it is very important that we can remember Kṛṣṇa at the time of

 

[Break]