20100130 Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam 5.14.22

mūkaṁ karoti vācālaṁ
paṅguṁ laṅghayate girim
yat-kṛpā tam ahaṁ vande
paramānanda-mādhavam
śrī caitanya īśvaram

Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.14.22

karhi sma cit kāma-madhu-lavān vicinvan yadā para-dāra-para-drav-yāṇy avarundhāno rājñā svāmibhir vā nihataḥ pataty apāre niraye.

karhi sma cit—sometimes; kāma-madhu-lavān—little drops of honeylike sense gratification; vicinvan—searching after; yadā—when; para-dāra—another's wife, or a woman other than his own wife; para-dravyāṇi—another's money and possessions; avarundhānaḥ—taking as his own property; rājñā—by the government; svāmibhiḥ vā—or by the husband or relatives of the woman; nihataḥ—severely beaten; patati—he falls down; apāre—into unlimitedly; niraye—hellish conditions of life (the government's prison for criminal activities like rape, kidnapping or theft of others' property).

TRANSLATION

The conditioned soul is sometimes attracted to the little happiness derived from sense gratification. Thus he has illicit sex or steals another's property. At such a time he may be arrested by the government or chastised by the woman's husband or protector. Thus simply for a little material satisfaction, he falls into a hellish condition and is put into jail for rape, kidnapping, theft and so forth.

PURPORT

Material life is such that due to indulgence in illicit sex, gambling, intoxication and meat-eating, the conditioned soul is always in a dangerous condition. Meat-eating and intoxication excite the senses more and more, and the conditioned soul falls victim to women. In order to keep women, money is required, and to acquire money, one begs, borrows or steals. Indeed, he commits abominable acts that cause him to suffer both in this life and in the next. Consequently illicit sex must be stopped by those who are spiritually inclined or who are on the path of spiritual realization. Many devotees fall down due to illicit sex. They may steal money and even fall down from the highly honored renounced order. Then for a livelihood they accept menial services and become beggars. It is therefore said in the śāstras, yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham: [SB 7.9.45] materialism is based on sex, whether licit or illicit. Sex is full of dangers even for those who are addicted to household life. Whether one has a license for sex or not, there is great trouble. Bahu-duḥkha-bhāk: after one indulges in sex, many volumes of miseries ensue. One suffers more and more in material life. A miserly person cannot properly utilize the wealth he has, and similarly a materialistic person misuses the human form. Instead of using it for spiritual emancipation, he uses the body for sense gratification. Therefore he is called a miser.

Guru Maharaja:.He is called what?... [Miser] This is which chapter, which verse, which canto. Fifth? And verse and chapter? Fourteen, twenty two.

So, this verse tells us about the pitfalls of sex life in particular and materialistic life in general. You see, if you don’t… if you don’t engage in Krsna’s service, then we are always endangered. So, the situation is very precarious for someone who is in materialistic life.

There is a nice verse in the Bhagavad-gita that tells us that lust is residing in the mind and the in intelligence, so that we are… we don’t have to look far where is our enemy. Lust is already there in the mind and the intelligence; is there to distract us. So, it is very important that we don’t succumb to the lust. Now Prabhupada said that the Krsna conscious grhasthas are not the same as the regular grhasthas because they engage in Krsna’s service. So, by doing that they are protected. Otherwise, like one guy was in Miami, in the airport. He said, “O you people! You are engaged in regulated sex life. But I am a Christian, and Lord Jesus said in the Bible, if you get married you can have as much sex as you want, as much.”

Did Jesus say that?

Now he can’t exactly point out the verse, but I don’t anywhere he says that, but anyway.

This is what they think. So, obviously, the more we engage, the more we succumb to the nature of the material conditioning. So, it is important that we don’t, as a Krsna conscious grhastha they regulate themselves, and in this way they can be safeguarded from these pitfalls that are mentioned in this verse. If they think that, “I have a license, so I can do unlimited”, that is a dangerous situation, because then they will be more attached to the body, and less attached to Krsna.

So, our Krsna conscious devotees, they worship the deities, they come to the temple, they have attachment to Krsna, still they have small attachment to the material world, but that’s… at least there is a balanced situation.

Now yesterday was the appearance day of our Acharya… Narottama Acharya. That… and I told the pastimes, but there are a lot of different pastimes. Last time I told the pastime of his first Gaura Purnima festival, but he also pastime… because he had initiated, he was a ksatriya, he was the crown prince, he abnegated his throne and to be a devotee, he wanted to be preacher. He didn’t want to be king. So, he had initiation from brahmanas, and others. … anyone who was qualified.

So, he … there is one Narasimha Maharja, he was responsing the brahmanas, and he was speaking against Narottama, “how dare he initiate brahmanas? We will go and challenge him to a debate. We are the Brahmanas, we uphold the brahminical culture.” So, they went there. Big group, they have marching band, like as if they are going to war, brahm… brahm…. But… so, Ram Chandra Kaviraja and the brahminical disciple of … what is the name? Ganga Narayana Chakraborty, they approached Narottama Dasa, what he thought.

So, I don’t mind talking with this people, but they come like this, in this challenging mood, they want to hear, they want to war, fighting or something. I don’t want to engage in fight. If they want to discuss, I will talk with them about Krsna consciousness, and I will convince them, but like this, this is not the mood for discussing on spiritual topics.

So, then they decided, “Ok, we will take care of this guys.” So, they crossed the river. Meanwhile, the other group was camped at… what it is called? Sanagar. Just opposite to river Keturi. So, this two devotees, they crossed the river, and they started to… two simple men, wearing the gamchas, and ripped dhotis and what not. One was selling palm leaves, and the other was selling wooden pots. Clay pots. So, they said, “look at, we will trade you with a brand new clothe, give your old clothe, we will give you some money for your stuff.” So, they bought from him the stuff, brought from this two guys, and they just… like local pan sellers, clay pots, and so they said, “in the market next to… on the road, and said, pan, pan, pan. This pan leaves. If you could take beetle leaves, you could take this pan leaves.

Actually, we decided that we can take pan leaves, it is not intoxicating, it is beetle nut, it is a little bit intoxicating. So, generally the devotees don’t take, although previously they would take. Anyway, so they were clay pots, clay pots, get your clay pots… these were two items which they have to have, and the brahmanas would eat them. Betel nut is dry, but you have to have fresh palm leaves, and then clay pots, they used to cook and throw. They didn’t have any problems to wash the pots. They would throw them. So, these two items were pretty essential for our travelling.

So, the disciple, the head disciple of the brahmanas, he went to the market to get palm leaves and some clay pots. Two sellers, “palm, palm, palm, hurry, hurry, hurry, clay pots. So… and he said, you know Kato dam in Bengali. They said in chaste Sanskrit they replied to him. He said, “you guys know Sanskrit.”

They said, “O! we are disciples of Sri Narottama. Always... Sanskrit. Narottama is a great pandita. He speaks Sanskrit.

Really? He know Sanskrit?

Oh. Aham gacchami… he spoke very nice Sanskrit to him. So, then he … you are going to challenge him? Ha, ha, ha, that is the funniest thing. What do you know? And the … everything they were speaking with him in Sanskrit. So, the guy… all the local people ha, ha, ha, all laughing at him. And he like all shook up… simple guy who sells palm leaves speaks Sanskrit, what to speak with the panditas, O my god…. So, he went back to the … meanwhile the king and his Rajguru, they were hidden in the clouds in the skies, just to see what is happening, and when the saw the disciple of the brahmana was just laughed away by the crowd, then they got second thoughts, “O no, what we are doing, what is going to happen to us? And they realized, “lets go and see this Narottama, ….12.40…

So, they went across the river and saw. So, they saw that Narottama was a very great devotee. He was very nice, he was very gentle, and they pleaded to him, “Please forgive us for any offence.” Meanwhile, the head pandita, the head brahmana, he appeared, he was outside, …..13.00…..Help, help… so, … last night Bhagavati Devi, she came to me in dream, she had a champar… please save me, o…. please save me…

Okay, okay, take it easy. I forgive you.

O I am saved. Otherwise, Bhagavati, she is one of the forms of Durga, she is going to chop my head off. So, like this, the whole campaign was dissipated, and they all surrendered to Narottama, and then Narottama said, well, listen to the Bhagavatam class. So, they didn’t recognize…. Who… Ganga Narayana Chakraborty or Ram Chandra Kaviraja… one of them gave the Bhagavatam class, and they all listened. So, in the end, they all… begged forgiveness from Narottama and Narottama was very much victorious and not doing anything….

Just Narottama Dasa Thakura ki.

Narottma ki….

So, of course Narottama is famous for writing many songs which we sing… bhajans… maybe like he was the crown prince…15.30… but then he was a ksatriya. So, it was a big issue to the brahmanas, that a Ksatriya was intiating the brahmanas, because they were very much following the caste system. But this is… Nityananda prabhu, he didn’t… he elevated people to the post of mahantas, regardless of what the caste they were. So, this was the system of the Lord Nityananda prabhu, and this is the system of practice by the followers of Lord Chaitanya, that the relation was more important, that being born of brahmana.

So, in one case, Narottama and Ram Chadra Kaviraja, they were living in their ashram in, they were headed to the Padma river to take a dip. It is said that for the devotees, for those who are not envious of the devotees, they bathe in the Padma river, they get love of godhead. But for those who are envious of the devotees, if they bathe in the Padma river, they get material suffering. So, Padma flows through the Bangladesh, and the Ganges flows through Bengal and Mayapur. So, this is… Bangladesh ever faced any kind of difficulties? What do you think? Does Bangladesh ever face difficulties? 17.42

See, Padma flows right through the middle of Bangladesh, and all those people who bathe in the Padma, who are envious against the Hindus and the Vaisnavas, they suffer. So, this could be one reason why they suffer so much. In any case, before them they saw two young men taking buffoloes and goats with some servants, and they thought, “O! the Kali pujas is coming up, maybe they are taking to offer as animal sacrifice. So, they are not Vaisnavas.” So, then they thought, lets preach to them, but then others said, they are not going to listen to us, because they are puffed up brahmanas. So, then they thought, Ok, you take the role of a caste brahmana, I will take the role of a Vaisnava, and let’s have a debate right behind them at a loud voice. So, they were arguing with each other. “There is no difference between Kali and Krsna. It is all the same.”

“What do you mean? Kali is the energy of the Lord. Kali is not the Lord.” Like this each one went back and forth. “Well, offering the sacrifice to the goddess… the animals… what is the problem? Anyway, it is Prasad.

“It is not Prasad. You offer this… you have tell to the animals ears, mam sa. I take your life now, you can take my life later.

Really? Tell what that means?

That’s what the mantra means. But anyway, it is given in the Vedas.

It may be given in the Vedas, as a concession to the meat eaters, but actually Kali doesn’t take the prasad, because she is a vegetarian, she eats only what Siva eats, and Siva is a vegetarian.

O really? Then why are you taking…

Like this they were having a loud debate. So, the two boys, they couldn’t help but overhear. So, then they thought, “what are you doing?” They came back and they offered their obeisance’s. Who are you two? Oh! This is Narottama, this is Ram Chandra Kaviraja. Can we learn from you about spiritual life? Yes, but not with all this goats and buffaloes. “No, no, I will release them.” He sent back the servants, to the father…

Shivananda Bhattacharya.. and then he sent his servants back and said, “tell that we will come back later. We are not offering these animals to the goddess.” So, they stayed in the bhakta program. You see, even in those days there were bhakta programs. Anyway, you are here in the bhakta program. So, you are here.

So, the two stayed… I forget the names, but the two stayed and they learned about spiritual life from the two acharyas. So, then they said, well, you go back to home to your father. When they came back home they were wearing the Vaisnava tilak, and the father looked at him, “O Kulangar! Kulangar!” This means, Kula is the family tradition, and angar means who is transgressed, “O you have defamed the family tradition, I cannot see your face, take off the tilak… oh….so, you should have the red tilak of the shaktas, of the worshippers of the kali, not just white. It is so hard to see. I never thought my son is going to wear this white tilak. And they tried to preach… no, no, I cannot hear from you, you are my sons, you are not qualified to teach me. I will call the brahmanas, let them talk to you.

So, he called the local caste brahmanas, and they convinced him according to the sastras, what they were saying is ok. So, they were saying, you don’t know anything, what do you mean you don’t know anything. I have a friend. He is a digvijaya, he has conquered all the four directions, he is the digvijaya of Mithila desha, I will call him, he will defeat this children. So, he called his friend, the digvijaya of Mithila desha. Mithila desha is where Janaka Raja was the king, and Sita was won. So, Janaka Pura is in Nepala, and the far of Mithila desha falls in Nepal, on the plane area, and part falls in Bihar, Bengal, just on the Bengal border. So, this is a very ancient place, Mithila.

So, this Mithila … came and he said, “how can I talk with the kids. This is beneath my dignity. I am a great Pandita as well, I have conquered all the four directions, no one has ever defeated me. So, you bring some Vaisnava acharya, someone, I will defeat them, I cannot talk to this children.” So, he brought some local acharyas, bhagavat acharya. So, he spoke. Of course these Panditas, they don’t know anything about, they only read their sections of the Purana. They don’t really know much about the Vaisnava philosophy. So, he said, you are allowed to speak first. So, the Vaisnava said, well, according to the sastra brahmanas have twelve qualities, they are very great. I accept to say that you are correct.

So, the Vaisnavas have the same twelve plus one more. Pure devotion for Krsna. So, the Vaisnava is greater than the brahmana….

He quoted the scripture.

Wait… I don’t know this is in the sastra. I am defeated. O no. I have never been defeated before. Oh no! I could not take the Vaisnava dharma. I cannot take it. I will become, I will chose a middle path. I shall wonder the world as a fakira, as a mendicant, and just beg for a living. I have been defeated, oh no…

So, there is no such middle path, he should have accepted the Vaisnava as his guru, but unfortunately he was very proud. So, and then Shivananda Bhattacharya, when he saw his digvijaya, great pandita was defeated by this simple Vaisnava Acharya, he became like mad. Oh no! abr… he praised the guy. So, the sons… anyway, what to do? They went back to Narottama and Ram Chandra Kaviraja, they told what happened, and they said, we want to be initiated?

They said, you can take only one diksha guru.

So, they were discussing what to do. We like to both, both taught us, we can take only one diksha guru.

So, they made a deal. Ok, you take one as a diksha, I will take him as a siksha. I will take the other ad disha you take as siksha.

So, because you are allowed to take many siksha guru, but only one diksha. So, they accepted the initiation, but no one could tell who is the disciple of who. They served each of the guru so nicely that they couldn’t really tell just by observing that this will have more devotion. They were very respectful to both the gurus, although technically the diksha guru gives instructions, should be considered to be more weight, but because both of them were in so harmony anyway, that the question came up.

So, this was the… like this Narottma and Ramchandra Kaviraja, they were preaching in different ways, in different tactics. So, gradually their name and fame spread very wide, and they became very famous, especially….

So, …

The three were together, Narottama, Srinivasa and Shyamananda Pandita. One day they took the books back. The books were stolen in a… what is that place called? Bankura; in the kingdom of Vsnupura in Bankura. 30.00So, this was all the books. There was a king there, and he had a astrologer. So, he said. He would tell, when the travelers are going across his kingdom who has a valuable treasure, and he had a special secret service who would go and steal the stuff from the people, and they would come to him as a king. He look, Ok we will try to solve this case, who are the thieves? Sometimes they get back a bit…

So, like this… Bankura is a kind of a poor state. So, it is now a district. In this way, he was making money, and then he read the Srimad Bhagavatam. So, that’s all, it mainly involves Srinivisa Acharya. But… so, this astrologer told, all the … there is a great treasure, there is a priceless treasure, this treasure is so valuable that I can’t even begin to estimate how valuable it is.

So, the king became, “Wow! I am going to become rich now. Now all my problems will be solved. I will get this treasure.” So, he thought, better let the thieves not see the treasure, because they may become greedy and steal from me. So, he made a deal, you will bring the treasure here, don’t open it. I will give you each so much. So, they went there. The Acharyas were sleeping, the guards were there… they were also sleeping. It was easy. They just took the treasure case, and brought to the king. When the Acharyas woke up, early morning bath and mangala arati, oh no, oh no, the books that Krsna Dasa Kaviraja, the six goswamis, all the books are gone, oh no! oh no! they were like … hitting their heads on the rocks and stone and trees. Oh no, they entrusted the books to us. Srinivasa said, look, the deities said, I should carry the books, there must be something involved. You will go back, khetari, you go to… Northern Orissa. When I find the books, I will tell you, I will send message, there is no need, the deity entrusted me, I will do the needful, you please go back. Don’t worry, these books – somehow they are protected by Krsna. So, Narottama was sent back. So, like this.

We had … we took a safari to Jia Gunga. There is a temple there of Ganga Narayana Chakraborty, and there Narottama was … it was like… on the banks of the Ganges, very close to the confluence where the Padma and the Ganges separate. It is within fifty kilometers or forty miles from Kethura gram. Kethuri is now in Bangladesh, and this is in India. So, I went there, and they have the Samadhi of one of the Manipuri kings, who came there to see Ganga Narayana chakraborty, and they have several, and they have the Samadhi of Narottama. So, we said, how did Narottama. He said, well, he bathed in the Ganges and he turned into milk. So, they scooped up claypot of milky water, and that’s all they put into Samadhi.

So, this place where he turned to milk is called the Dudha Ghat, the milk bathing ghat. So, we all took our bathe there, and Narttama like that, he disappeared in the Ganges, he didn’t leave any mortal body after him. So, we bathed in the dudha ghat. This last two years ago, I took… two or three years ago, I took this safari to Bangladesh after many, many years. This time we had… one of our devotees was retired, what they call, IDIG, the deputy inspector general of police. So, he was high rankings. So, he knew all the superintendents. He was retired. He was recently retired. So, we phoned him up and said, you please take care of this safari there, they are going to visit the holy places, are all in Bangladesh. So, we had about how many… around hundred and fifty devotees from the thirty-five countries. We had a lot of Russian speakers. Normally they only get a single entry Visa for India, but because of … double entry. So, they could enter into Bangladesh and come back.

So, not everybody came with a proper Visa, but we had like hundred and fifty to two hundred. So, went around Bangladesh. So, first half … after the Haridasa Thakura’s stop was Khetari. So, there is a tree called the Prema Tala, in that tree the love of Godhead was kept for Narottama. So, when he … Lord Caitanya left love of Godhead in the Padma river. So, the Padma said, how do I know who is Narottama? He said, when he will bathe in your water, he will feel ecstasy, and he also chants Hare Krsna. So, you will experience some ecstasy when he chants Hare Krsna, you give that person love of Godhead.

So, when Narottama went to the Padma, he took his bathe, and then at that place then she gave love of Godhead to him, and he changed from darker color, he changed to a very lighter color. So, when he came home, his mother could not recognize him at first. She said, what happened?

I don’t know. I bathed in the Padma, and it changed my color. And at that time his love for Krsna. So, this devotee, we stopped under the Prema tala and we saw the different… we saw the temple where… the most of the deities had been shifted to Vrindavana. We saw the place where Narottama used to have his temple. And then he went to some other place where Narottama used to write. So, but some of the devotees they didn’t know at first, they were sleeping under the prema tala, they were sleeping under the tree which had love for Krsna. So, when he woke up in the morning, he told him, you have slept under the prema tala, and they were very happy. O Jaya. So, all this places are still present there. Many years ago Subag Maharaja, he went to see this Khetari. At that time, he had some Indian money in his pocket. So, the policed chief stopped him, and had Indian money. Said, you crossed over the border illegally. No, no, I didn’t. He didn’t have his passport. He left his passport somewhere else. So, they arrested him. They thought he was illegal, like that. So, then, one secretary of the government was a Hindu. So, he saw his passport, said, it is all right. he is not a inter-faith, Nothing, he is a sadhu, he is a ok. So, that person became a supporter of Iskcon after that. So, we take it that the cue was set by Narottama, his name was KV Roychoudhury, and he became the official president of Iskcon in Bangladesh, although he was not following all the four principles. But to have a secretary retired from the government, it was a good strategy, because the local government they knew that, ok if he is the secretary, if had a high protocol, high clearance. So, nobody messed with Iskcon. So, like that he always had some very high, the president post. He is usually not necessarily a devotee. All the other posts are devotees, but one post we keep for some PA head, who is some general or some secretary, or someone recognized by the government as a Hindu leader. So, that way… so, this all happened connected to Khetari and Narottama. So, we want to pray to Narottama Dasa Thakura that he give us the blessings to preach, to distribute his books, to sing his bhajans, to give love for godhead freely to everyone, regardless of caste, creed and nationality and gender, any kind of discrimination. This is what he was famous for.

Jay Narottama Dasa ki….

So, any questions?

Question:

Hare Krsna Maharaja.

You mentioned early in the class that becoming a Vaisnava is more important than so to say a brahmana, something like that. I kind of have that experience in my spiritual life that sometimes when I am say practicing skills like mridanga, or doing kirtan, or memorizing slokas or different things, I tend to feel that I am maybe becoming more advanced, or advancement, because I am developing those skills. Is that the proper so to say I should be working on? Or is there different. I guess what really is becoming a Vaisnava? What does that include?

Guru Maharaja: Interesting question. It is like you thought of the question at the end of making it.

Learning slokas, are all those other external aspects. We want to be qualified to our guru, to be able to preach. So, we need to learn the shastra, we need to learn to behave properly. So, but that is external because the essence is that we give everything for the pleasure of guru and Krsna. Now we want to please Krsna. That’s what the Vaisnava is. We want serve Krsna. Our thoughts, words, deeds, eternally. Now a brahmana, say they identify as a spirit soul… Aham brahmamsmi. They should easily want to… easily they are impersonalists, they want to merge into the Jyoti. So, the Vaisnavas, they want to serve Krsna eternally. So, they like to go to the spiritual world and serve Krsna in one of his spiritual planets. There is a four Vaisnava sampradaya is mentioned in the Padma Purana. It says if you get mantras from these four, if you don’t get from this four, then your mantra will be nisphalataha, it will be without fruit. So, the four mentioned are the brahma, Rudra, Sri and Kumara. So, we come in the Brahman sampradaya. Lord Brahma, Lord Siva, or Laxmi, or the four Kumaras. These four are authorized. So, part of a being a Vaisnava is that if we get the opportunity, we don’t… we don’t retract or unnecessary delay in taking initiation from a guru in a bonfide disciplic succession. That’s part of it.

Now like Jiva Goswami, in order to serve his guru, Rupa Goswami better, he wanted to qualify himself. So, he went to the Benaras University, and he learned Sanskrit. So, he was a very great scholar in Sanskrit. That didn’t make him a Vaisnava. He was Vaisnava because he did it to please Krsna, to please guru. He thought that he could use this. So, learning slokas, reading all this are good, if you use it for Krsna. If you think, O I am great, I know so many slokas, I am better than this one, he only knows seventeen, I know twentyone, I am the greatest … obviously it is not going to help you in your spiritual life. So, we want to… all those things are okay, it is good, you want to be a qualified disciple.

I had one disciple from Guyana. He said, he was a migrant to Canada, and he was making forty dollars an hour as a welder. So, he thought he was really the greatest, because he was making so much money. Welding…sh… so, time his family was back in Guyana. He hit the taverns and had some… those from Trinidad and Guyana, they like Rum. So, he had a few Rums. He met some sankirtana devotees, who tried to distribute Bhagavad-gita. No, no, I am a Hindu, I know this, I have this, my grandfather used to read. So, he went to another Tavern, had some more Rum, this time again the same devotee happened to be outside. Said, “Sir, you are a great Pandita I know. This Gita is very good. Please, I am begging you, please take this Bhagavad-gita, whatever you give as a donation, I will take it. He thought, Just see, I am an immigrant from a foreign country, and this local Canadian, he is begging from me. I have achieved it, I have made it, now, Ok, ten dollars, give me that book. Put in his briefcase, you know, next day the Rum had worn off, he had a headache, he opened the book, O Bhagavad-gita. So, he started reading the Gita, and then saw, O here in Toronto, there is one branch, 243 Avenue road, let’s go there. So, then he went. It happened to be like a day before yesterday, the Nityananda Triodashi. So, there was a big kirtan, there was a big feast, that was it. He got drunk in the kirtan, prasadam feast, food for life. So, then he read all the verses, and the so called panditas from Guyana, they don’t know much. Just they present themselves. Bhagavad-gita says, aham sarvasya prababho, I am the cause of everything… they don’t know what to say. So, like this they used the slokas, preaching to the fellow Guyanese, many devotees. Since then he has migrated to Holland or… this is how he became a devotee.

I was puffed up, I was proud, I thought I was a great wielder, I later hurt my back welding, but I got the mercy of the book distributer, he gave me the Bhagavad-gita, and because I was humble, somehow I took it. And that Bhagavad-gita saved my life.

Jaya book distribution ki.

Jaya Sankirtan ki…

So, if you use your slokas, if you use your brahminical qualities to expand your preaching, to do service to guru and Krsna, that is ok. But what makes you Vaisnava is wanting to use everything for Krsna. Otherwise, what is the difference between you and the pandita? This pandita, digvijaya, he wants to show off, he knows more that the other. Jato …, tato mata. As many munis, as many opinions. So, we all have the same opinion. We want to serve Krsna, that is our unity and diversity, but … we have the same purpose, the purpose is to serve Rukmini-Dwarakadisha, Radha-Madhava, Hare Krsna, Jagannatha Baladeva Subhadra, Gaura Nitai.

Hari bol.

Any other question?

One more question.

Give her the mike.

Mataji: She is asking what attitude we should have when we see devotees attacking, how can we heal our heart without breaking our faith, especially when some of this attacks are coming from other devotees?

Guru Maharaja: How should we feel when we are attacked by devotees?

Attacked means physical or verbal?

Devotee: inaudible

Guru Maharaja: Well, it depends if devotees are senior, peers are junior. If they are like new devotees, either one way, if they are senior devotees, well … you have to see if there anything wrong in what they are doing, what they are saying, we take a … if there is a big doubt maybe the senior devotee is not perfectly speaking, we can discuss with our guru, or others. But we have the faith that, ok, if they are doing something wrong, then their faith is based on their experience, their knowledge of sastras, they want to do so not because they hate me or something, its what their opinion is, based on what they know. Thinking of someone more senior than that person, say a local president, senior or G.B.C or one’s guru, and just to… if you have doubt that this devotee says that I shouldn’t read the Caitanya Caritamrita before the Bhagavatam because … otherwise I am in total Maya. Nowhere. Prabhupada never said that… there is a systematic way you read the Gita, Bhagavatam, Caitanya Caritramrita, but he didn’t say if you read a little Caitanya Caritamrita you are in Maya or something. Some devotee may say some… that is a little extreme. We had some devotee come to Mayapur and tell everyone… that if you, I forget what he said but like …. Rasa lila you are in maya or something. But generally a new devotee when he reads the Rasa lila, that comes later. So, there are some devotees, they maybe sanyasis or they may be some senior devotees. So, they have their opinion. We can bounce them off. We can… if they are all senior devotees say the same thing, well then you are wrong. At least we should question what we are doing, is it correct, is it something, why does the devotees think wrong of us? Why are they attacking us? So, we want to be sure that what we are doing is right.

After that, like some devotees have a different opinion. You can’t please everyone, but we don’t want to hold any hard feelings to our heart to that devotee. We accept that the devotees, that their opinion is based on their Krsna Consciousness. They didn’t have the highest, then they had a particular angle on Krsna consciousness, which may not be applicable to me. Maybe it is applicable to some people. Like this. If it is just your friends or some junior devotee, you can be a little bit more, you can debate with them, you can discuss with them. Why did you say like that? And you quote some slokas. If it is a senior Vaisnava, you can ask question, but you shouldn’t like challenge, no you are wrong. You shouldn’t… you can ask questions, Prabhu, it seems like, I have a doubt. And you ask a question. And you always have a right to ask a question.

And … I was with Srila Prabhupada, and he was once talking to me, a brother of Bhaktisiddhantha Saraswati Thakura. So, he asked a question. So, he said, asking a question is not a offence. It was a bit of a funny question, but he asked it as a question. Now we didn’t have much experience of Prabhupada dealing with someone of a superior position, because Bhaktisiddhantha had already left the world, and this was the only person that was, he had only one god brother, and he had already left. So, this was the only Vaisnava left. To some extent was like similar level, because he was a brother of Bhaktisiddhantha Saraswati Thakura. So, I had this personal experience of what he said. It is not offensive to ask questions.

So, you ask a question. You can say, I have this doubt, or you are saying, I respect you, I have my self-esteem, but I have this doubt, and you say your doubt is, and then they will either answer it or not. So, like this you can ask questions. But we shouldn’t like ….

Some Prabhupada disciples had gone over to some other mission, and left Iskcon. So, then he said, you should be open, you should embrace all the other…. Srila Prabhupada told us, we should stay in Iskcon. That proves how we love him. How we love is how we cooperate with Iskcon leaders, how you cooperate with Iskcon devotees. This is my doubt. So, you saying I should leave Iskcon, but Prabhupada said, you should stay in Iskcon. So, I have this doubt. So, technically we are not offensive. Of course, …., myself and other Prabhupada disciples… more harsh with such people but maybe the grand disciples will be a little respectful, but immediately firm, say you are wrong, not just be swept away, who is the person speaking, if the person is actually a local authority, then why is he saying that. It is something you look in to. Maybe there is something you are doing which is not proper, or otherwise… but it should be dealt with very … I don’t use the word diplomatic, but using atticate.

Others like to add something to this?

So, does anyone want to say anything?

Devotee: …. All the seem to be very valid and significant. I think that if you are in a position of some kind of responsibility in Iskcon these days, you know, it is very difficult to… devotees in general to understand how properly approach a senior Vaisanva, or Vaisanvi, and we respect. I think this is one of the … one of the things in Iskcon today that things are very difficult, is that a lot of times one’s own godbrothers or godsisters won’t even step forward and support a senior devotee, such as yourselves in the position of guru responsibility. I think that there needs to be more than that, and I think that the second generation devotees, they should understand that anyone that is a Prabhupada disciple and still serving in Iskcon today, they have gone actually through a lot of situations, a lot of austerities, a lot of sacrifices, and they may never understand what that austerity or sacrifice is. They may have somewhat of an understanding, but I don’t think that they will really understand what that means to be there in beginning with Srila Prabhupada, and serving today.

There is that, I don’t know, for a lack of a better word, there is this mystic, I don’t know that anyone could see, or even like myself, very difficult for me to fully appreciate the association that you had with Srila Prabhupada, or any other disciple that had association with Srila Prabhupada. That association, that activity, I will pine I never understood the extent of that, although I may have an inkling. But I think that we should try to teach the second generation how to become more respectful of a Prabhupada disciple, and how they need to understand the difficulty that it is, or it takes to go in Krsna consciousness, and yester … there would be mistakes made, there will be a lot of situations that they may not like, or may not appreciate, but it should be understood that anyone that is performing the service in Krsna consciousness for so many years like yourself, or any other senior devotee that, it is not by some material you know power or position, or it is… it is actually devotion, and I think that needs to be exhibited more, explained more, talked about more, so that there can be this better understanding of that position. Hope I make sense, but I just feel that there needs to be more of that in our society today.

Devotee: Radhanatha maharaja was giving a good example of two devotees, the two brothers from

Mayapur who are the pujaris, Jananivasa and Pankajangri, those two brothers, he was glorifying them saying that they had been through so much in Mayapur, so much… he even said that we accept that there are falls and difficulties in Iskcon, and politics and so many things, but these two brothers, they remained faithful to Srila prabhupada service, their humility and their dedication to Srila Prabhupada may overcome all those problems. So, anyone, any devotee going through difficulties like that, if they remain loyal in service, and dedicated to Prabhupada, to the mission… although certain things become meaningless and insignificant, and of course you give a good explanation of how to deal with seniors, with equals, and junior devotees, with the proper atticate. So, the attitude that you were explaining of how to adopt was perfect. But I was adding this two devotees as example, serving Iskcon for almost forty-four years, their humility, their dedication, and their loyal service to Prabhupada made them strong, and inspite of all critical things that happened, they remained victorious, and they remained like good examples for us to look up.

Thank you.

Guru Maharaja: I know Jananivasa and Pankajangri are very special devotees. I … as a co-director in Mayapur, G.B.C., I had to deal with all kinds of issues. One of them will come to me, and discuss something, and if someone else came, and you were talking some management issue, I look… didn’t involve them, they are gone. They are just … they are focused on the deity service, and what to speak of like prajalpa or other things, I mean they didn’t even….hear other management issues that didn’t involve them.

To some extent Pankajangri, he is a little involved in management, but Jananivasa, he is like completely absorbed in his deity worship. That is one thing, and the other, now occasionally, this is… now occasionally they visit Vrndavana or they visit Chaupati or something, to see the different temples. But we are like twenty years, and never left Mayapur. And especially Jananivasa, one time he thought, “Ok, I will go to the Ganges and take a dip.” no sooner that he go to the Ganges, then there was a like a big problem in the pujari. So, he was always like… Prabhupada wanted the standard for the head pujari of the Krsna-Balaram mandira in Vrndavana. When he told that the standard would be that they would never go to Loi Bazar, they will never go anywhere, they will stay with the deities, the head pujari left. He got next life….

So, it was … it is top to be aware to be connected to the deity and that is like your total service. So, but we are told that if we do the service in conditioned life in this world, our service maybe of pujari or sankirtan, or whatever maybe, we do our devotional service, that’s our connection to Krsna, and not everybody… sometimes someone has to do management, but not everyone has to do it. So, on the other hand, when we are in the spiritual world, we are in Krsna’s lila, and then our relationship with Krsna as a cowherd boy or cowherd girl or a queen or parent or whatever, that will be the predominant thing. It is not like Nanda Maharaja chanted sixteen rounds. He may not do that. But he is totally Krsna conscious, he is always thinking, eating, serving Krsna as his son. So, he is always thinking about Krsna every moment. He worships some deity and offers the prasadam to Krsna, he doesn’t think Krsna as God, he thinks Krsna as his son. So, we can take that kind of relationship in the spiritual realm or in the lila of Krsna. While we are in this life it is our service. So, what your service is? Your service is to preach.

When…. qualified to preach, when we are able to explain Krsna consciousness properly. Whatever you service, if your service is of a pujari, you have to please the deities. If it is service of sankirtan, you distribute books, and make a favorable impression.

Like according to whatever your service is, we do that. So, here we have, like when people come to the temple, nice if there is someone who is assigned to take care of the visiting people, because that is one thing that, like in India… that girl lived in San Deigo, Laxmi Prakash, she confided that she went at noon to the Hyederabad temple, and there is no one to talk to her, although she was a donor.

So, like thing is, we sleep up, they never forget. So, I went to the Unitarian Church a few weeks ago. And they have at least at the Sunday service, they have some members of the congregational volunteers, they greet the people whoever are coming; even Walmart greets the people, right? So, they greet the people who are coming, and anyone knew, they give him a visitor, first time, or they have some name taker of the award. So, they have a nice sticker. So, it is nice if someone does that service, because… we found in Mayapur, everyone complained that no one had the time to take care of them. So, they made facilitation booth from nine to five, at least there is someone there to guide the people where to go, what the should do. Some, whatever your service is. That is your connection to Krsna. So, you want to do your service, it is real nice. You want to do as expertly as possible, and in this way, so, it is not that any service is less meaningful and honest. All the services are important, but whatever we do, we try to do it carefully, and now if the service is cooking, if we cook the Prasad, then Krishna will be pleased, but when the people eat the prasadam, they will also, their love for Krsna will be awakened, like that Prasad.

So, Lord Caitanya, He would taste the devotion of the cooks in the Prasad, and I have a personal experience of cooking in Montreal, cooking and offering, and I was like head pujari, the temple president, the head cook, there were only four person in the temple, so, a lot of things in one time. So, I would cook all the Prasad, I will say someone else, “make up the plate”, I jump in and take a quick shower and come back, wear my tilak, I take the offerings to the deities, Jagannatha, Baladeva and Subhadra. It was so ecstatic to take the offerings to Krsna. I have not words to express. So, every service you can get unlimited nectar if you put your heart into it. That’s my humble experience.

One thing, when I joined in 68, there was three temples in Iskcon: San Franscisco, New York, and Montreol. I saw all the temples. (laughter) But now I have not seen all the temples. It is very difficult to see all the temples. There is like five-six hundred all over the world.

Who has seen all the temples? Mongolia, Philiphinnes, Papo-new-gini.

I may have seen more temples than most devotees, but I have not seen all the temples.

But in 1968 I saw all the temples. They were going to open up L.A that time, from Montreol they went over to open Vancouver and Ireland, and opened up the Toronto. So, like this. Prabhupada is in the mood, open temples one time, and he said, boil down the milk. Make the temples we have strong and self-sufficient.

So, like that we went through different stages. At the end of his pastime, he had a 108 temples. So, this was predicted by some astrologer, that he would make a hundred and eight temples.

Srila Prabhupada ki…

So, one person is 108. We have all assisted him, but he was the one who had the vision, he was the one that was caring for us, pushing us, so, we are unlimitedly grateful to Srila Prabhupada. He is our life, he is our soul.

Srila Prabhupada ki … jaya.

Thank you.