19820509 Sunday Feast: How to Expand the Preaching

The following is a class given by His Holiness Jayapatākā Swami Mahārāja, on May 9th, 1982 in Toronto, Canada.

Jayapatākā Swami: …and their profits for the expansion of the movement, so Prabhupāda, he had to build up brāhmaṇas. He said, “I need brāhmaṇas. I need people to teach society.” So, he said half of the job is done. You see, he has made brāhmaṇas other half was to do varṇāśrama. What about the others, the vaiśya, the kṣatriya, who has going to be in the society, who are going to work outside but they are going to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa in their home and they are going to contribute money. They are going to do other type of service. They are going to preach and more devotees will be able to come.

So of course nonetheless we have to go on making more devotees and seeing who is ready to be called by Lord Caitanya. At the same time I see that the problems in maintaining the temples will be greatly reduced as the congregation is increased and as the people feel that they are benefitting by Kṛṣṇa consciousness they willing like to give something to help the preaching of the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement so that preachers do… have to do less preaching less saṅkīrtana based on paraphernalias and other things and they can do more preaching based upon simply giving out books and giving out spiritual instruction, but this is a long range program. It's going to be gradual… because first of all as soon as a person becomes attached to the temple becomes… he’s not immediately going to give out so much finance. As they start to benefit and start to see spiritually how the temple is helping them more and more they’ll be encouraged to give.

We find that in… for instance like in Calcutta or India the big big rich people who are the big influential Indians, they become life members but they hardly ever come to temple. They gave one time money after that it’s very hard to approach them. But the middle people who are coming and they are regularly chanting and they are taking part, they're part of the Nāmahaṭṭa program or Friends of Lord Kṛṣṇa program, the Vaiśya-ṛṣī program, those people because they are regularly chanting they are associating with devotees some of them are taking initiation, they give a huge percentage of their time and if they are making money even of their money to the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement because they actually have realized… They are devotees. They have realized that this is a very good thing but they don't leave their families, they don't leave their businesses, they work outside but they are very intimately connected. But it takes a while… it takes some time for them… even Indian people like that to come up to that level. What to speak of in the West it would take some time of cultivating and… I know that for instance, I started the program… or encouraged them to start it in South America where I am a guru and there was one boy in Peru. I convinced him to start to chant and he started 2 rounds a day. I came back 6 months later and then he said that now he is chanting 4 rounds and he’s stopped eating meat, fish and eggs. I came back 6 months later, that was after a year and he was saying that now he is chanting 6 to 8 rounds and he was stopping taking all types of alcohol and marijuana and things. Then again after year and half I came and he said now he had given up… he was chanting 12 to 16 rounds, and he given up smoking and he was following all the principles at that time, and so then I encouraged him “Now you should steadily chant 16 rounds.” So it's going on for 2 years like that gradually but he is also… the temple said that he regularly gives donations he sometimes gives 10,000 soles 20,000 soles of their currency. And sometimes he gave what? Some high-fi stereo, you know, he is a very favourable person but he was a bit attached, I mean he just couldn’t, all of a sudden but devotees encouraged him and he was able to form his own position to gradually advance.

So of course for ordinary saṅkīrtana devotees who are you know used to go out with bags of books and you come back you know with that much result or for other types of bhakta leaders and that it might be a little slower, but it doesn't… we need only… It needs maybe one person to concentrate in an area and other people to know and then preach and assist. And I have firm conviction and faith that by the mercy of Lord Caitanya you will find many many people out in the material world who will practice Kṛṣṇa consciousness and as you build up their ranks, then gradually over the period of the years they will supply a very strong base from which we can expand Kṛṣṇa consciousness in another whole dimension. And then when you also have this strong base especially in these Western countries which are all democratic if you have thousands of followers then they have to give you more facility for preaching because they are afraid of losing votes.

If the Catholic Church wants to set up a booth in the airport they could do it. No one is going to object. They could do whatever legislation because in Quebec everyone is a Catholic more or less. But of course They don't have to, so they don't bother to do that. Similarly if we have a big following then we can get more and more facilities. Now if you want to do preaching on Catherine Street probably it’s very hard to get permission, but if you have 50,000 voters in Hare Kṛṣṇa then they are going to make some arrangement. Otherwise there are going to be few aldermen or people then not going to get elected next time.

You see it works like that. In New Vṛndāvana because they have their own little area there. Bhaktipāda was saying that every time the commissioner comes out during the vote time and says please vote for us and they fix up the roads and they do whatever they want because they hold the majority of votes. So we are not directly into politics or anything but the point is that these are other side benefits that at least for our preaching it would also… people would give us more facility the government and other people although they are not unfavorable they cooperate, but if they really knew that we had a broad base it would be so much more easy to get different facilities, so there’s many many different ways you can see it, and is this definitely is one direction that we have to take.

When we calculate how many books we distributed then we want to see that from that how many people are chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. That's the natural next thing we want to see. So some senior devotee who is able to patiently cultivate people and bring them up from one step to the next you see, he might be encouraged to do that kind of a preaching to recognize the devotees… who is more serious and others there is basically few stages that seem to be popular in England and South America they call like the associate member. Amigo de Kṛṣṇa in South America, Friends of Lord Kṛṣṇa in England. I don’t know what is in French. In Italian it is Amichi de Kṛṣṇa and so first is just one is someone is a little bit favorable his name is on the mailing list. Then the next is they chant one round per day.

In Peru I called… we had a meeting in the National Library and 500 people came there, and in India you know we have these big pandal programs and I request all the people to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and to promise to chant everyday 108 times minimum which only takes 5, 7 minutes. I asked the people “How many of you can give 7 minutes a day to make yourself completely happy and peaceful? Is there anyone who doesn't have 7 minutes a day to raise your hand? All those who want to be happy raise your hand. Anyone in the room wants to be happy, raise your hand.” You see. “Everyone that wants to see the whole world happy, raise your hand. Everyone wants to see the movement of Caitanya Mahāprabhu to make everyone happy raise your hand.” You see like this then you say, “How many can give 7 minutes to do it? Raise your hand.” (devotees laugh). So then we say how we, “Our request that you should chant Hare Kṛṣṇa 7 minutes a day at least. 108 times you see.” So I do that… India we get 500,000 people they all sign up and we cultivate them and we deal… So then I told them in South America the same thing will work.

But they said “No, no no. Here the people you know are a little bit different.”

So, at the National Library I had four… I had 250 cards from Calcutta, even though it was the wrong language, in English. Everyone speaks Spanish. I gave the same appeal and the 400 people lined up to sign. I only had 200 cards. Other people signed their name and address on a paper that when you get the card you send to me. We will daily chant. You see, maybe a different percentage of people in different places will do it, but if we have a nice program if you just appeal to the people “Why don't you try chanting? Doing a transcendental meditation. And then try chanting. See if you benefit. For one month, try it. For one year, 5 or 10 minutes a day. If you can… then if you like it then you can go on increasing.” In this way more and more people as they start to chant you see that the whole atmosphere will change. People will start to become happy.

Yes?

Devotee: Mahārāja I’d like to thank you for coming here. I always look forward to when you come. I’d like to ask you to give a translation of Navadvīpa Māhātmya. I can’t find the volume anywhere.

Jayapatākā Swami: No. When I go back, I’m going to finish that.

Devotee: But how will that be available to find?

Jayapatākā Swami: That's gonna be published by BBT. The rough copy has been done, but the final thing… of course, it’s going to be a BBT publication so has to be known as perfect. So therefore I have to go for final editing of it. We finished about… We finished a good part of it. The whole thing is done, rough, but now the final. Yes?

Devotee: (French)

Translator: Authorities in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, do they have a direct link with Kṛṣṇa?

Jayapatākā Swami: Yes, through the guru-paraṁparā. But that… that is a direct link just like if you see the wire from here and if you take the wire right now and I rip it down and I say that you touch the end of the wire and grab it. You have the direct link to the power house. No?

Translator: (French) 

Will you explain it to him?

Translator: (French)

Jayapatākā Swami: So in the same way the direct power if its not coming down and how the devotees are able to work and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and be so happy? You can explain?

Translator: (French)

Jayapatākā Swami: You see just like if you want to go to a doctor you want to see if he can cure your disease, by coming in contact with the leaders of this movement if you follow their instruction and advice when you get transcendental happiness then you can know that they are in touch with Kṛṣṇa and they can give you Kṛṣṇa.

Translator: (French)

Jayapatākā Swami: You see, Kṛṣṇa consciousness is not meant to give up everything. But it means that everything is done in a spiritual way. We have spiritual eating, spiritual resting, we even have spiritual families. We have so many spiritual activities. Everything is done in a spiritual way. In a Kṛṣṇa conscious way. Nothing is missing. Everything is complete.

Jayapatākā Swami: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Yes?

Guest: Sometimes people are chanting, and they are not feeling happy, because they are not really…

Jayapatākā Swami: That means that they must be committing some offence. 

Guest: So in the next stage, their chanting must be…

Jayapatākā Swami: So they should start to chant more seriously in a more humble way. They must be developing either some other desires are there, so instead of tasting the holy name they are building up other desires. Fame, prestige, breaking some regulative principles, doing some offence. If you follow the system properly it will definitely melt your heart.

Devotee: Sometimes we come in contact with people who are… come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness but they don't want to belong to any kind of ritual, or any identification with a particular group. So how can we encourage them to chant the mahā-mantra and… so that they don't feel that they’re being… dragged in this sect?

Jayapatākā Swami: They can chant in their own house. They don't have to belong to the group. We don’t say that you belong to the group.

Devotee: But why this mantra in particular?

Jayapatākā Swami: huh?

Devotee: Why this mantra?

Jayapatākā Swami: This mantra is recommended in all of the Vedas. Just like it says in Kali-santaraṇa Upaniṣad

Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare
Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare 

iti ṣoḍaśakaṁ nāmnāṁ,kali-kalmaṣa-nāśanaṁ 
nātaḥ parataropāyaḥ,sarva-vedeṣu dṛśyate

iti ṣoḍaśakaṁ nāmnāṁ, these 16 names, kali-kalmaṣa vināśanaṁ It takes out… destroys all of the contaminations and dirts and evils of Kali yuga, nātaḥ parataropāyaḥ, there is no other superior alternative. There is no other positive alternative than this. nātaḥ parataropāyaḥ, sarva-vedeṣu dṛśyate - this is the conclusion of all the Vedas.

In the Nārada Pañcarātra, it says that all of the powerful Vedic mantras if you condense them and put them together into eight words that is

Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare
Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare

Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare
Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare 

Jayapatākā Swami: Eight words. (laughter) 

Devotee: So can we encourage people to chant like other names of God.

Jayapatākā Swami: If they don't have faith in Kṛṣṇa, we are not parochial. They can chant another name of God.

Devotee: And they’d be gradually purified to accept it.

Jayapatākā Swami: That they can... We know that by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa we get the benefit. And that if you chant similarly follow the similar process we are doing, if we chant any bona fide name of God then you can also achieve benefit, the same way. you see but there is no name as merciful as Kṛṣṇa. If you know that there is only one common God for everyone, then that's the basis, where is the harm if you chant His name in English or in Hebrew or in Sanskrit or in Chinese or whatever, you see. The point is that each name if is the proper name… in Sanskrit, Kṛṣṇa means “all attractive, the reservoir of all pleasure” it's a very merciful name, very powerful name. The word God is a very vague thing. Dios, Deus, in Spanish it is Dios. ? So it's a very vague thing. Means creator or great or something. It’s not very definitive. You see so like that but if any bonafide name you can chant it. But according to the meaning of that name you get a certain reciprocation. So this name Kṛṣṇa is some very special name because it touches a very intimate point in Kṛṣṇa's heart.

Devotee: What is meant when Lord Caitanya said that there are no hard and fast rules for chanting, when as we go on we say there are so many offenses, and so on?

Jayapatākā Swami: You can chant any time, any place. You can chant it on the roof, in the street. You can chant while you lying down, while you standing up, while you standing on your head, while you are in the bathroom. You can chant at while you are eating. You can chant at anytime. There is no hard and fast rule for when and where who can chant? Anyone can chant.

Devotee: But if one commits offenses in chanting, he doesn’t get the…

Jayapatākā Swami: But it's still better to chant even if you commit offense. But if you commit an offense in the holy name, the only way to get over that offense is by chanting more holy names. Just like if you commit an offense to a Vaiṣṇavas. how do you get forgiven for that?

Reply: By begging.

Jayapatākā Swami: You have to go to the Vaiṣṇava. If you commit an offense to the holy name, then how do you get forgiven for that. You can only get forgiven by chanting and praying to the holy name for forgiveness. There is no other way, you see. The holy name is the only competent authority to forgive offense against the holy name. And even the demons… of course that were fully Kṛṣṇa consciousness in a demonic way, they got liberation. As better to be an offender… chant the holy name offensively than not to chant at all. But it's best not to be an offender of the holy name and chant offenselessly. So one should strive for that.

Devotee: So what happens if somebody comes to the temple often or periodically but doesn't want to chant it?

Jayapatākā Swami: Well, Prabhupāda said even if they hear that's also good. By hearing gradually , this thing like say many of the devotees in our temple, they may have been practicing several births before. They might have been coming to the temple like that and hearing it for one birth. Then they in the next birth now they are living in the temple as a devotee, you see. As long as they don't disturb anything alright, we want the people immediately… We can engage in service. Some of those people sometimes if you just know “Alright. He’s a tough not. He is not going to chant. He is not going to become a devotee right now, alright. But engage him in some service.”

Devotee: Eat prasāda.

Jayapatākā Swami: Eat prasāda… No. You have… before they eat prasāda, you can also get them to pick up buckets and do things like that. A lot of times, these people will do some service. They don't mind working. They are mindless working, then they do chanting, some people. (devotees laugh). And by serving they gradually, they’ll get purified also.

Devotee: Will you tell us the importance and the impact of the harināma when we go in the street we are in front of people, when we go out the use of what is going on. What is the benefit of the harināma?

Jayapatākā Swami: Unlimited benefit. You see they are able to hear the holy name. That’s entering into the heart they are destroying so many… so many of the sinful reactions and they may be afraid or they may laugh in the beginning. When Haridāsa Ṭhākura used to loudly chant. Sometimes people would criticize. Go, “Oh, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, ha ha.” (laughter) he would look very grave. So that is why they would think that “Oh we are successfully agitating his mind.” And they would chant out loudly “Ha ha ha, Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa!” group, you see and then that way inside he was very happy that they are chanting hare Kṛṣṇa more and more. (laughter). The more they chant Hare Kṛṣṇa the more that they will be Kṛṣṇa conscious, the more they will benefit.

So many devotees, they see devotees chanting at that time they don't know what it is. There is a devotee in Toronto now. He can remember seeing devotees chanting in McGill in 1968-69, but he didn’t know anything it is walked by, “What’s this?” And now he is a devotee. That chanting plants seeds in the heart.

Devotee: What about people who come to the temple and sometimes there are children, and say they come and chant, or whatever but you know they steal things, like that? You want to encourage them, because they’re making spiritual advancement, yet they’re committing offenses by doing those things, so how do you deal with that? Do you let them still come, or?

Jayapatākā Swami: No. Well, if you can’t… In India we have everything in such a way that you can’t steal anything because there’s nothing around there, but if they still find a way to steal then, we throw them out, because that’s not sincere. Unless they can come sincerely… to come to Caitanya Mahāprabhu for some material reason or something…

Devotee: Let them be benefitted by that (inaudible)

Jayapatākā Swami: No they can.

Devotee: On the streets, (inaudible) What is…

Jayapatākā Swami: I know that in Africa and some places there are a lot of theft, they just keep everything out of reach. Here people are more honest. So they don't worry so much about theft, but still it happens. So then if things are kept out of reach maybe then they can come and if it's not there then… (inaudible)

Devotee: So we should not allow these… sometimes there are so many crazy people that come in and do nonsense.

Jayapatākā Swami: No. We’re not… we have to be practical. Chanting the harināma is… one can do that. But still we don’t… people should commit the offenses before the Deity or steal the Deity, then we know its better that they chant Hare Kṛṣṇa outside. They’re not ready to come to the temple. Unless they can at least keep some minimum standards.

Devotee: You were talking about this devotee would go to a place and gradually cultivate people, had this expertise, of gradually bringing people forward on the path of devotional service

Jayapatākā Swami: Whatever he does you encourage him.

Devotee: So is there a set method of reading books, making cards before chanting, and chanting in forms…

Jayapatākā Swami: No, you can see different people are doing in different ways in different places. In terms of preaching so how was it kāla-deśa-pātra - time, place and circumstance. Some people become Kṛṣṇa conscious by going to cooking lessons and associating with devotees and learning how to cook and chanting. Some people become just by friendship with devotees. That’s the main reason why many people come because they make friendship with a devotee. Some one has to be a friend with these people but not on another level but in a Kṛṣṇa conscious level. Whatever they do in Kṛṣṇa consciousness you encourage them.

“Oh, wow you are chanting two rounds? Very good. Then you know you can try to increase.” encouraging. Not that “Oh you only do two? You are not advanced. You are not good.” Then they feel discouraged. Sometimes devotees… like some one says “Oh I’m chanting eight rounds.”

And then the person, “Oh you are not chanting sixteen rounds.” Then they lose their enthusiasm. They lose… Because they are not so advanced, that type, they need to be encouraged.

“Oh you are doing very well. How much nicer if you could do better?” You know in a positive way. Positive alternative. Encouraging them. Whatever they’re doing, it's good. “Try to do more.” So how if they’ll listen… the closer it is to taking the… our standard program, the better. You know, in the slight variations you know it can be cooking. It can be a festival. It can be so many other little things. Whatever… it can be music, it can be drama, whatever you can engage them in yena tena prakāreṇa. Whatever means you can get them to have more faith in Kṛṣṇa. The devotee has to agree… has to be careful not to associate another level you see too much. Not that he becomes like them. But they should become like him. They should become more advanced. Any mothers?

Devotee: Yes, so um what about seeing paraṁparā when you try to make friends with a karmīs? Sometimes you have to do so much (French)

Devotees: Compromise.

Devotee: So that thing that you can’t even see paraṁparā because the paraṁparā is so strict, you know?

Jayapatākā Swami: You mean in the preaching?

Devotee: Yes when you’re preaching to someone sometimes has to compromise so much to accommodate them to sort of…

Jayapatākā Swami: You don't have to compromise. It's just a question of knowing how to present it. That's why I find it to do this type of preaching when a new devotee can do it requires someone who has such a broad understanding of the philosophy that he can present it to the people without compromising it.

Devotee: I give you an example. There was a guest here on one Sunday, and the woman came running to me, “Please please come and preach to my husband. He doesn't want to listen. We are trying to convince him about reincarnation, and this and that. Some devotees are trying to speak to him, but he is preaching to them. So I was a little reluctant to go because I thought that, “Well, if he won’t listen, what’s the use? Let him take prasāda, have a little association and he may come back." So… But the experience was that the devotees that spoke to him are young devotees. So they didn’t quite know how to approach him and just ended up… it ended up he was still pretty much cool headed and controlled in his misconceptions, in some ways. And the devotees left completely fried out and frustrated. [break] 

Jayapatākā Swami: In the congregational program this is a little bit different, maybe… in the temple of things, but the same principle is there. Prabhupāda said we can keep cows in the barn if they give milk. You see, so ,we can spend time with a person as long as they are actually taking the association and appear to be benefiting by it. If the person seems to… Prabhupāda said, “How do you know if a person is sincere? When you speak to them and they listen.” If you speak to them and they don’t listen… they just immediately give another question or they don't seem to be listening you know, then you know they’re not very sincere yet.

If a person would listen then the more association you give the more it will start having effect. If they don't listen to you, if they’re not actually listening then of course they are not sincere. So then you just put him on a mailing list, and then gradually they may become sincere later. So how much time you give to a person will depend on how sincerely they’ll listen. And then when they listen then how they actually you know try to practice.

So it may be a gradual thing. But if they are listening and they are trying so then you give a little time, little time and you spread it out, and then a person is not really listening or just wants to waste time, so you be friendly. So you don't bore the person but encourage them but you don't waste so much time on that person until there is little more ser... you just keep a friendship and they’ll start… keep coming. That means they’re not yet ready yet. They have not keep them yet by māyā. so you just keep them friends. You know no reason to his burn them out because they are not that sincere then you spend more time with those who are more… proportionally more interested. And then as you train up other people like that they would be able to go and preach to these people because they are little more on their level. They can waste more time with them. (laughter) They have more time to spend you know and then they can cultivate people like that and bring them up to the next level.

Many times you find people dont follow regulative principles. They had been many times devotees to the temple. But they themselves don't become devotees, fully. Because they just have some… They like Kṛṣṇa consciousness but they just have some attachment. They have some lack of faith themselves. So that was described even in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta some have pracāra and some have ācāra. To have both ācāra and pracāra is very rare.

Some can do some little preaching. Some can do some practicing. But to be perfect in practicing and preaching that is more rare. So you can even have a person, he may not be fully you know pure, but he may be able to give out a few books out to do some kind of little… to bring his friends to the temple and that way that’s also a preaching.

In India we have agents who distribute books. We have 50 members of the Nāmahaṭṭa who take 20 books every two weeks and give them out. And one man he gave out… he almost sold 6,000 literatures last year. So we see that in the long run this way many books to be able to be distributed. Say you have 1000 active Friends of Kṛṣṇa in a congregation of say 10,000. So the active people you give them some quota “You give out 5 books you give out 10 books, you give out 20 books. You sell to your friend or you pay for it or your own thing you give them out. However, your responsibility is that 10 books go out this month or 5 you know.” So this way… or 20 for another person say average 10 if you have 1,000 that’s 10,000 books a month. With the devotees then only one man is distributing 10,000, one man through all these people.

So now we just… every month we pack them up and we mail them to them. Some of them are living far away from Māyāpur. We just send you know like… in the distant towns. We send them the 10, 20 books and they distribute and then they send back the money and then we send them the next set. So there’s so many ways are there like people can be engaged in some preaching. When the travelling parties go they stay in their houses and preach to them. That’s how this one devotee is my disciple in Toronto who used to be Śaṅkara, now he is Vraja-jīvana. He… the devotees used to always go to his house and stay there onn saṅkīrtana. And he let them use this house for a saṅkīrtana base in Waterloo, and as a result he became… from the association of the devotees he got great faith. And slowly he is following 16 rounds of chanting and all the principles. He wanted initiation. Yes

Devotee: I was wondering if it seems sometimes devotees are really busy. There are people in towns where maybe there isn’t a temple where maybe devotees are travelling through… like you know one person in particular I know really relishes the association of devotees and sometimes I know that devotees are going to be going through that town, so I give the address of this particular person asking them to just maybe drop by and give them a little prasādam or whatever, but it seems sometimes devotees are so busy that they can’t afford to even spend 10 minutes, a half an hour or things like this, where I was thinking that maybe if we do you know, little things like this, it would encourage these people like this to even respond or serve more. Because like I know this particular person, if a box of BTGs or books etc. were dropped off there, this person would make sure they were actually given out. But it seems sometimes that even if you approach devotees with this.

Devotee: It has to come from the top.

Jayapatākā Swami: It has to come from the top. We have to organize like that. If they can… if it comes from the leaders then the people they can do a program in the person's house like once on a two weeks or once a month. He can invite his friends and you know even the gṛhastha couple can go and the wife can teach the… his wife, if he’s married, how to cook. You know they can bring over the people. They have a whole little cultural thing. You do a kīrtana. You have a little short class. Play some of the new, you know recordings of Kṛṣṇa rock, or whatever the depending on the kind… (laughter) or you show the video show.

Devotee: There’s so much preaching to do.

Jayapatākā Swami: And the now there’s 27 videos, or something right? 27 or 29 I heard. So I mean, there’s so many shows and then there’s slide shows. So you can… it can be a little lively. It doesn't have to be… Even in India everywhere we go we have our slide projectors we have our cinema projectors and we show… thats the main thing. Everything is audio video.

Devotees: Jaya!

Jayapatākā Swami: So what to speak of the West where they’re already used to multimedia? Yes?

Devotee: I was just wondering how all this preaching in Bengal, how is it affecting Communism? 

Jayapatākā Swami: Many Communists are becoming Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Devotee: I heard there’s a lot of Communists. Is that right?

Jayapatākā Swami: Well it’s just… you know it comes in waves. The previous political party didn’t make the people happy so the Communists said “We will make you happy.” Right? Now the Communists are in power. Now the people are becoming frustrated. Maybe this term or next term, they’ll probably get kicked out. This is… you know they’re are same cheating and the same everything as anywhere, you know. So they complain that “You see this is because we are Communists in a Capitalistic system. So we have to do is have…” but everyone can see that they are cheating also.

Just like in Quebec when I was in 1968-69, then there was a different party. Then came the Quebec Party. After I left they came in power. But now already I heard people are getting frustrated because economic situation is bad. This always happens in this world changing. First in America, there’s Republican then the Democrat, then Republican then the Democrat. But Śrīla Prabhupāda said that only cure for Communism… atheistic Communism is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is the actual solution.

Devotee: The book is published now?

Jayapatākā Swami: Yes. It’s been published soft back now we’re also publishing in hard back.

Devotee: In Russian?

Jayapatākā Swami: Bengali he asked.

Devotee: Do you have a Gītā in Russian?

Jayapatākā Swami: I don’t know. I don't think so. In Polish they have now. We have to get special computers to publish these languages Polish, Yugoslavia, Russia. These are very complex languages. To try to write Sanskrit in Russian...

Devotee: There’s not many sounds. There are a lot of sounds there’s no (inaudible) whatsoever, in Russian.

Jayapatākā Swami: Śrīla Harikeṣa Swami is a great person for doing these things, but he’s made the computer program himself, personally. 

Devotee: When we want to become a preacher when we want to preach, how can we be a perfect instrument you know that the way we speak the way we move, it’s right on, you know? (laughter). How can we be powerful in our preaching? Sometimes we preach, we will repeat the words and all that, but it seems to miss the power, the śakti?

Jayapatākā Swami: You see the point is we do not make Holy Name our servant. We become the servant of the holy name. Its not that now when we say, “Now I’m going to chant and I am going to become ecstatic!

Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare
Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare
(laughter)

Why am I not ecstatic?” 

or that “Alright, now I’m going to preach here I am a great preacher now I’m going to preach. Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya. Why everyone is not surrendering to Kṛṣṇa? I'm preaching. Me. The great, you see. Alexander." We cannot force the Holy Name. It's not our servant. We are surrendering to the Holy Name. (Child crying) That we are your instrument of holy name. We are the medium.

[aside: Is there cookies or something to give out?]

We are the medium.

Devotee: (inaudible)

Jayapatākā Swami: No? Therefore we chant and we absorb yourself in that consciousness we absorb yourself in saṅkīrtana as a servant of Kṛṣṇa, as a servant of Lord Caitanya, as the servant of the Holy Name. Let the Holy Name engage us. When we want to say something, pray to our spiritual master, pray to the holy name to purify consciousness to engage ourselves in the service. Unless the Lord gives some mercy its not possible to preach. It's not possible to experience this. It happens by the Lord's mercy. It is not a mechanical thing.

It is something that is a descending mercy and therefore as soon as you get a little proud you think that “Now I know how to do it. I’ll go out and do it.” You can fall on your face. Because that mercy will be… as you say even you become more and more expert but never forget for a moment that “Unless the Lord gives his mercy I won’t be able to do it.” Therefore, before we speak we always offers respects… our prayers to the spiritual master, Lord Caitanya, Kṛṣṇa to get their mercy. Then we can preach. Then we can touch people's hearts. By His mercy.

If it touches someone's heart that's the mercy of the spiritual master and Kṛṣṇa. The preacher doesn't think that… No. That, “Somehow or another by my greatness it’s touching their hearts.”

“Somehow another by their mercy I’ve been able to be instrumental in touching their hearts. By their mercy.”

If I somehow think that only due to me or something like that then the mercy may be cut off and I won’t be able to preach properly anymore. The more we can surrender in that way, the more we actually transcend material conditioning.

Do you have any questions?

You are liking Hare Kṛṣṇa movement?

Guest: Very much.

Jayapatākā Swami: Oh, thank you. You are having any question, with the Bhagavad-gītā in hand?

Devotee: No. (laughter)

Jayapatākā Swami: What’s his name?

Devotee: He’s been in the movement 11 or 12 years.

Devotee: I’ll be alright. (laughter)

Devotee: It’s hard to tell these days.

Jayapatākā Swami: Incognito.

Devotee: Secret weapon. We must make an apology that there’s not enough prasāda. Are there some predictions of when the actual prediction of Lord Caitanya will happen and everyone will be chanting congregationally?

Jayapatākā Swami: it's happening.

Devotee: There’s supposed to be a flood, a big flood, where everyone drowns.

Jayapatākā Swami: Just don’t turn off the socket. Don’t dam it up. The flood waters are already there. It's only the devotees’ lethargy that can stop it… can delay it, and then the flood will have to find some other route. So you surrender and be the instrument and the flood waters will be running over you. And if you hesitate long enough then the waters will have to break in through some other place.

Devotee: That’s nice.

Jayapatākā Swami: Kṛṣṇa consciousness cannot rest at all. We are the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Therefore we are the only ones who can give Kṛṣṇa.

Devotee: Yeah.

Jayapatākā Swami: We are the instruments now if we humbly dedicate ourselves and carry out the orders of Prabhupāda, then we will be the instruments. But If we get puffed up, and don't surrender to Śrīla Prabhupāda's desires then Kṛṣṇa Caitanya will make some other alternative.

Devotee: (chants japa) As long as there’s one pure devotee… (inaudible) Śrīla Prabhupāda…

Jayapatākā Swami: That’s what we are following and that’s why Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is spreading very very rapidly, it is practically flooding. In the whole world so many people are chanting more and more, day by day. We find that in North America it started first. Therefore North America has to lead the world in some new program.

Just like you know there’s different… and sometimes people were doing one type of saṅkīrtana then it slightly changed: a whole nother, nother, but in terms of the preaching in North America you find people have this idea that its not going fast enough, this that, it’s a fact. But it is going very rapidly in all other parts of the world. It’s also gradually expanding here. But obviously if the devotees instead of thinking how is not expanding, if they think how to expand it, and they go on working it, with that enthusiasm like Prabhupāda did when he came to the West, Kṛṣṇa will inspire you in so many ways for expanding the preaching. Sometimes Kṛṣṇa makes it a little hard so that one is forced to think of new ways to preach. It is said that difficulty is the stepping stone to success. So now it means that you just have to use your transcendental intelligence to expand the preaching.